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BRodgers
23 January 2004, 11:07 AM
Hey all,

Just a hypothetical quiestion.

When has a GM gone "too far" in the consequences regarding character actions?

Meaning...if a GM has a series of event planned out and the PC do something that is disasterous..should the GM step in and alter events/plotlines to protect the pc's or just "let the chips fall where they may?"

I ask because in our last game sessions we had something similar happen....a PC did something that was...well...questionable...and the aftermath resulted in a situation that really had NO good resolution for the PC...

I wont relay what happened (saving it for the fiction dontcha know), but I thought this would be an interesting topic to get some feedback and thoughts, and maybe even let the RS players at the table give their two cents..you know, here, in public, where to world can scrutinize their opinions.

:D

personally...I think the GM should let the chips fall where they may. If he begins altering the actions of the Empire or crime lords to protect the PC's then they stop being villains and become window dressing.

One of the things that has made the RS campaign great is the sense of loss and sacrifice...everything we do doesnt always end well and the heroes dont always win the day...at least not without a price to pay.

It's what keeps me coming back, even now, 5 years later and what keep everything interesting...because you literally have NO idea what is going to happen from one game to the next.


Just my opinions...thoughts?

scottyboy
23 January 2004, 11:24 AM
I only think that the GM should let the "chips fall where they may" to a certain degree. I certainly agree with the concept, the players got themselves into it, they should have to figure a way out. But I also see that some situations can't necessarily be resolved on "good" terms (i.e. one or more of the players die as a consequence). In those situations, for the sake of good game play and keeping the peace, I think that the GM should step in and possibly alter the plotline a bit to make it more accomodating to at least the POSSIBILITY of a good ending, if you know what I mean. However, in those situations where the GM chooses to intervene, I think it would behoove said GM to have a private talk with the player(s) responsible.

waza sunrider
23 January 2004, 02:04 PM
Well at the risk of sounding ,, well like me.
It has happened on a few other occasions & charaters died, in this one npc's died I am glad things weren't change to make it a happy ending. It wouldn't have been fair or right to the other players from past situations. no details because the fiction is coming.
but thats my opinon.

Nova Spice
23 January 2004, 05:31 PM
I completely concur, Bob. I'm one of those GM's that "lets the chips fall where they may" when it comes to personal character decisions, particularly if a PC does something outside set adventure guidelines.

For example, last session, one of my PCs took a contract from a Peace Brigade leader and actually turned in one of my other PCs. That's right, one of my players betrayed another player, who happened to be an NRI agent, to the Peace Brigade. On top of this, my rogue PC gave the Peace Brigade information on the location of my other two PCs, causing them to lose their ship and be set adrift in space.

In one session, Dassk, our resident Ubese mercenary caused Dyen (NRI agent) to be captured and Eeth and Bram (members of Talon Karrde's organization) to lose their ship and belongings.

I didn't bother to intervene. He made the decision. Now he has to live with it. And according to Eeth's player, Dassk's player may be rolling up a new character sheet soon. :D

Darth_Cassed
23 January 2004, 05:50 PM
Our group lets the chips fall in the broadest sense. This not only affects PCs, but the NPCs and the storyline as well. Many times have I killed villains unexpectedly or completely altered the future, but we just roll with it.

In one situation, we got the the villain's room and at the dramatic moment we sniped him. He died with one shot before his big doom speech, and the journey was over like that. In the same campaign, we got our hands on millions of credits, and my character died in a fight.

We don't alter our storylines to protect anyone, we instead alter storylines at the risk of everyone.

Hell, in the campaign where we're rich, we blew up the death star and shot down Vader's TIE Fighter at Yavin!

Talk about Infinities ;)

BRodgers
23 January 2004, 05:56 PM
Originally posted by Nova Spice


I didn't bother to intervene. He made the decision. Now he has to live with it. And according to Eeth's player, Dassk's player may be rolling up a new character sheet soon. :D

YIkes!
8o

Thats brutal Nova!

Man, those Ubese can be tricky little fellas...one of our players, Sam has been running an Ubese bounty hunter for...oh, going on about four years now....and hes currently going through some interesting...changes...shall we say.


Still....any time a player purposefully does something that costs another player his character...thats pretty messed up. Our group used to game with a fella who had a knack for creating jerky characters and bossing around the other characters. and doing things that would potentially kill off our team (had we not been looking for it)..that didnt last and eventually he was booted out of the group.

Was this player of yours a newer player that didnt realize what he was doing? Or one of those experienced gamers who "like to stir it up?" Were there any hard feelings around the "table" as it were? And what about allowing the captured character to try an escape? Or do you think thats giving the character/player too many chances?

Nova Spice
23 January 2004, 06:23 PM
Was this player of yours a newer player that didnt realize what he was doing? Or one of those experienced gamers who "like to stir it up?" Were there any hard feelings around the "table" as it were? And what about allowing the captured character to try an escape? Or do you think thats giving the character/player too many chances?

No, Andrew has been playing table-tops for about four years now. His character, Dassk, has been suffering from severe emotional trauma since his sister died at the Battle of Ithor nineteen months earlier.

There were no hard feelings, in fact Bram's player told me that he felt Dassk's actions just added a whole new level of drama to the campaign. As far as Dyen's capture, he doesn't know it, but the guy who hired Dassk to capture Dyen was actually his former superior in NRI. Unbeknownst to the group, this former NRI leader has a sinister plan for Dyen in bringing down New Republic Intelligence to pave the way for the Vong's push to Coruscant.

I am positive that Dyen will try to make an escape. He's an expert computer specialist within NRI. He has Computer Use +20 as a skill and is considered the "god of all things electronic." I am certainly going to allow Dyen a chance to escape--mainly to see what might happen should he get out. I imagine Dyen will want Dassk dead, too.

I'm actually looking forward to what Dassk plans on doing. He has some pretty crafty ideas and he told me out-of-session that he plans on dealing with Eeth and Bram if/when they come after him. Needless to say, my PCs are representing the "fair-weather ally" syndrome synonymous with the New Jedi Order. I'm damn proud of their role-playing.

I just hope it turns out well. I'm not going to interfere in anyway. I'm just the game mitigator! :)

Boca Jantho
23 January 2004, 09:40 PM
Thought I'd chime in since I am the GM that spawned Bob's original post.

When it comes to combat or an outcome solely based on the "Roll of the die" I always protect my PC's. Only once have I not and that was at that particular players request.

But when a player makes a decision, I play it out no matter what. Sometimes I add consequences to the things the players want. In this particular situation ( without giving away too much) one player decided to go on his own to a crime lord to get a ship that the rest of the team had already made plans to steal from the Empire anyway.

In short, NPC's died, some of which had aquaintences with other PC's. It just got more and more ugly and I completely underestimated how the rest of Raptor Squad would react when everything came to light. So in essence I, through my decisions as GM, forced a player to have to change characters. I feel after the fact I may have gone too far in assigning consequences. Maybe a bit "over the top"

I'll just have to sort out my thoughts and feelings on the matter before our next session,

Thanks for everyones input and I'd like to hear more, if anyone else has something to say.

LAter
Tony Garrett

XanderPaddox
24 January 2004, 03:04 PM
Well, I have been playing Xander ever since I joined Raptor Squad back in December of 2000, and I must say that I have enjoyed playing the same character for this long. There have been numerous situations where I thought that Xander was not going to make it. But as players, there are thousands of decisions that we must make during the course of game playing, and sometimes those decisions don't work out the way we want them to. But we must live with the decision we make. If the GM was constantly correcting our actions just to make sure that we live, then what fun would that be. I mean, nobody wants to see there character die, but it happens. And the one thing that I like is that Tony, the GM, gives us opportunities or hints you could say to make us think about what we are doing.

All in all, I believe that the character should be held accountable for their actions.

:D

BRodgers
24 January 2004, 03:50 PM
Well put Alex,

Give yourself three character points...

;)

Nova Spice
24 January 2004, 05:37 PM
Agreed Xander, your viewpoint on the matter is identical to my own. As a GM, I wouldn't have it any other way. ;)

BTW, I imagine playing in a campaign with the Baron is quite exciting. Is he as insane in-game as he is in everything else? :D

XanderPaddox
25 January 2004, 09:37 AM
Well, playing around the table with Bob is definitely very exciting. He brings a different element to the game as does everyone. I think what makes playing with Bob so much fun is that he is willing to tell you like it is, no matter what the situation is, whether it is good or bad. Like in our last game session, there was an event that took place where...well, you'll just have to wait for the fiction to go up.

Let me just put it like this, everybody brings something unique to the game. And all the types of characters, that we have, no two are alike. There is so much diversity around the table that it makes so interesting to hear everybody's viewpoints on various subjects.

Let's just say, I look forward to sitting down around the table and playing the game.

:D


Xander Paddox: Your Resident Tapani Noble

BRodgers
26 January 2004, 07:34 AM
Originally posted by XanderPaddox



Xander Paddox: Your Resident Tapani Noble

HA!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You're killing me Big Al!!!!!!!!

:D

XanderPaddox
26 January 2004, 12:49 PM
I try my hardest!

:D





Xander Paddox: Your Resident Tapani Noble

Nova Spice
26 January 2004, 08:03 PM
I propose the members of Raptor Squad meet the gang from The Big Easy. Between you guys, I'm almost positive that the only sane moments will be insane. :D :P

With that in mind, might I inquire when the new revamp to the website will be finished? If it's not too bold to ask, of course. :D

elfgirl1973
26 January 2004, 09:12 PM
Ha! Playing with Baron Bob? Try being married to him (which is great fun, let me tell you)! Seriously though, I really enjoy sitting around the table with this group. We all have fun together even when we aren't playing the game. And Tony is the best GM I've ever played with. He crafts so many storylines and gives the game this big epic feel. I've not experienced anything like that before. Khara hasn't shown up in the fiction yet (hopefully before the year is out), but she's so darn fun to play.

Anyway, the update is happening February 14th, Valentine's Day. Mostly, Bob and I just needed a couple of more weeks to get the artwork done and polish everything up. It's going to be so cool. I can't wait for everyone to see it!

BRodgers
27 January 2004, 04:13 AM
Originally posted by Nova Spice
I propose the members of Raptor Squad meet the gang from The Big Easy. Between you guys, I'm almost positive that the only sane moments will be insane. :D :P

With that in mind, might I inquire when the new revamp to the website will be finished? If it's not too bold to ask, of course. :D

Ah the Big Easy!

Love those guys! great site!
I have no doubt if both groups met up it would be nothing short of epic....oh, maybe not JLA-Avengers epic...but still...

Well, as the esteemed Mrs.Rodgers pointed out, we are shooting for a 2-14 Valentines Day roll out. Why? Cause we LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE the community!

And cause I drag butt....

Nonetheless, everyone can watch the board here for an update a week before roll out and of cours once the site goes live.

:)

Nova Spice
27 January 2004, 01:36 PM
Alright, sounds great Bob! I look forward to 2-14-04! :D


Ha! Playing with Baron Bob? Try being married to him (which is great fun, let me tell you)!

I would imagine Baron Bob 24/7 would be most entertaining, elfgirl! I can only imagine what he does outside the SWRPG community! :P

At any rate, rock on people. Raptor Squad's by far one of the top personal RPG sites on the net. ;)

Koort
27 January 2004, 09:29 PM
As frustrating as it can be to lose a character, i agree that the chips should fall. Scooping PC's out of situations they made for themselves doesn't really lend to a tense and exciting game - everyone could start thinking that "it'll all work out in the end," and the sad fact is that it doesn't always work out. Now, a GM should always give indication that choices will lead to Very Bad Things, or give opportunities for the player, in-character, to change their mind about the course of action.

One time I lost a character to a stupid decision on my part. I'm going to be sketchy here - again, Gamelogs are coming - The player Bob mentioned who had a knack for making jerky characters was trying to resolve an issue privately with other PCs in the group. I had my character tag along to eavesdrop, and that led to me losing the character in the long run. It sucked, but it was my own doing, and i feel the GM would have been acting unfairly to scoop me out of it.

Likewise, my current character, the aforementioned Ubese who is going through some interesting changes, will have to start making decisions that will affect the long-term playability of the character. I have to balance my desire to keep him in-play against where his life and viewpoint are headed, and try to find a middle ground that accomplishes both. In the end run, though, it is my job to ensure that the character stays alive and in-play, not the GM's. If i take stupid chances (and this character has miraculously survived a great many of those!), do things that harm the group, or rack up a ton of Dark Side Points, then it's my own doing. It's not my GM's job to solve my problems for me.

BRodgers
28 January 2004, 05:00 AM
Originally posted by Nova Spice


I would imagine Baron Bob 24/7 would be most entertaining, elfgirl! I can only imagine what he does outside the SWRPG community! :P

You mean theres...a...a..WORLD outside the SWRPG community?!?!?!
:)



At any rate, rock on people. Raptor Squad's by far one of the top personal RPG sites on the net. ;)

Thanks for the props Nova!!!!!!!

I know our site appears to have limited offerings due to it being strictly D6..but with this new update...and subsequent updates...we are steering the site and our our focus more towards items and materials that can be used by everyone , regardless of what system you use.

Thats not to say that we still wont be offering new NPC's and their D6 stats as they show up in our game, just that we are going to be offering a whole lot more...such as game fiction, images, ideas and fleshed out adventures and "sourcebooks"....so hopefully those who havent checked us out before will take a gander and walk away with something they can use and those who have always been there for us will be entertained by the new offerings.

;)

Darklighter
28 January 2004, 08:04 AM
Originally posted by BRodgers

Thats not to say that we still wont be offering new NPC's and their D6 stats as they show up in our game, just that we are going to be offering a whole lot more...such as game fiction, images, ideas and fleshed out adventures and "sourcebooks"....so hopefully those who havent checked us out before will take a gander and walk away with something they can use and those who have always been there for us will be entertained by the new offerings.

;)

Oh Bob... that sounds fantastic!! I'll be keeping my eyes peeled, and you know peeling eyes is a bloody business. :D

BRodgers
28 January 2004, 11:47 AM
I like peeling eyes...the crust is delicious.

:P