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Arakyd
13 April 2001, 09:53 AM
Deck and I where talking about how incompetent Admiral Daala was. So I thought it would make a great topic.

Who do you think was the most incompetent EU character?

Rigil Kent
13 April 2001, 11:03 AM
What more is there to say? You've started (and ended) the discussion. :)

Seriously though, I can't think of ANYONE more incompetent than Daala, although Kyp Durron came close.
"I'm the Dark Lord of the Sith!"
"Hi, it's me, Han. Come back into the Light."
"Okay."

Bleech.

Emperor Xanderich II
13 April 2001, 01:52 PM
Kueller from The New Rebellion was fairly lame IMO. Shoes up at the start, dead by the end without really doing that much.

Thrawn was also really bad... j/k :D

Armadious
13 April 2001, 03:17 PM
If Darksaber was the only book with Durga the Hutt I would have said him, but it isn't so I go with Daala.

Sithspawn
13 April 2001, 03:58 PM
Actually I was going to say Durga the Hutt too.

Rigil Kent
13 April 2001, 04:18 PM
Oh, thanks EmpXan. I'd forgotten about him. Where did he come from, anyway? One of the Jedi Academy books?

Templar
13 April 2001, 05:52 PM
Durga is in SotE (briefly). And plays a large role in Crispins Han Solo trilogy.

Most pathetic EU character is...

CALISTA!

either that, or all the characters introduced in Crystal Star. Tough call

Sarge
13 April 2001, 07:23 PM
I nominate Kevin J Anderson. Incompetence personified. :P

Jan-lo
13 April 2001, 07:39 PM
I don't know - he wasn't really IN the books was he? Okay, I vote for him too, but my second choice is R.A. Salvatore, and then Callista. Definitely Callista! :D

C: "I've been given a second chance at life, but I just don't feel much like my old self... so I think I'm going to freak out, run away and mess it up as much as possible, so, uh, see ya!"

Templar
13 April 2001, 09:13 PM
Actually, I feel sorry for Salvatore. His first SW book he was handed a set of objectives (including introducing the Vong and killing Chewie). I want him to write a couple more NJO books to really see if he can really do it.

Superdog
13 April 2001, 09:15 PM
I vote for Daala, she's mind boggling incomnpent. She's such a loser I became dumber by reading about her.

She was kinda hot, though.;)

wolverine
13 April 2001, 10:30 PM
Remember, in the first of the Jedi academy novels, when Dalla was being described, se was griping and moaning about those who thought she only got to the top by sleeping with Tarkin?!!!??! Well, with her track record for fubars, i think they were right!

Lokar
14 April 2001, 04:52 AM
I say all charaters from a novel by KJA gets my vote, and Calista, and anybody from the New Rebellion.

Darth Xavian
14 April 2001, 06:56 AM
Daala is horrible. Ugh. Callista is her best friend.

And I thought Vector Prime had an excellent Star Wars feel to it. People just got mad because Chewie died, but I think it's good that he did.

Silberpfeil
14 April 2001, 07:32 AM
I'd say that Daala was really incompetent but well, I think Kyp is still the worst.

Emperor Xanderich II
15 April 2001, 05:16 AM
Originally posted by Rigil_Kent
Oh, thanks EmpXan. I'd forgotten about him. Where did he come from, anyway? One of the Jedi Academy books?

I don't know if he was in any of the Jedi Academy books (I haven't read them). I first came across him in The New Rebellion, which by the way, is a poor read.

ALFRED_THE_EWOK
15 April 2001, 09:50 AM
I would have to say Daala. She loses every single battle she's in, but she still lives! And Thrawn dies! :?

Karam Nor
17 April 2001, 10:19 AM
What about every leader of the New Republic who wasn't Leia or Borsk Fey'yla? They seemed to change in every book without any explanation of continuity?

I disagree with Daala being the MOST incompetent, because I think she actually worked well as a character. She was never good enough for her rank, and did get there by sleeping with Tarkin, such that when she had the chance to prove herself, she did so vigorously, but without the skill or mental ability to do so.

Of course, she had to deal with Kevin Anderson's penchant for the grandiose and overwhelming, so the poor dear really didn't have a chance.

Roy Cowan
18 April 2001, 10:44 AM
Well, since everyone has already ripped on Daala and Kyp...

Jacen Solo: Whines that no one's really following the way of the Force, and uses it as an excuse to sit on the fence and do nothing. Haven't read the latest books, so I don't know what he's done lately, but his intervention with Anakin at Centerpoint helped spare the Vong and wiped out a lot of Hapans.

I'd say Luke Skywalker, but Corran and Mara already covered that ground in I, Jedi and Vision of the Future. Interesting how both those books seemed to have sections devoted to cleaning up the inconsitencies and general rubbish in the KJA/Hambly books.

-- Roy

Shorty
18 April 2001, 09:30 PM
Originally posted by ALFRED_THE_EWOK
I would have to say Daala. She loses every single battle she's in, but she still lives! And Thrawn dies! :?

Yeah of course she's still alive so KJA can write another excuse for a book. Zahn isn't afraid of killing off his characters where as KJA seems to think Daala is well liked and deserves to survive (how wrong can someone be!)

Shorty

Superdog
19 April 2001, 01:04 PM
It is good that Zahn killed Thrawn, could you imagine what KJA would have done to Thrawn? It makes me shudder. Daala has cheated death, what?, like three times now, it gets old.

Rigil Kent
19 April 2001, 06:10 PM
Originally posted by Roy Cowan
I'd say Luke Skywalker, but Corran and Mara already covered that ground in I, Jedi and Vision of the Future. Interesting how both those books seemed to have sections devoted to cleaning up the inconsitencies and general rubbish in the KJA/Hambly books.


Ironic isn't it, that the "How Timothy Zahn Could Fix This Mess" fanfic was floating around on the net for so long and then HE DID! :D Cracked me up.

I've already voted for Daala but can I second Sarge's vote for KJA?

Darth_Xanthor
16 June 2005, 11:24 PM
Originally posted by Silberpfeil
I'd say that Daala was really incompetent but well, I think Kyp is still the worst.

Kyp is pretty bad, As was Daala. Tionne is almost uselss, but she has her perks.

The entire Jedi Accademy trilogy was horrible. NOTHING really happened. small battle, Exur Kun falls way to easily....and everyone just seemed to sit around with their thumbs up their asses,

The best part is when the twins ran away from chewie and c3po in the holo zoo

BrianDavion
16 June 2005, 11:36 PM
Tionne is a solid "bit charcter" she's actually appered once or twice in my campaign simply as a good source of "jedi background info"

and I agree the Jedi Academy trilogy had SERIOUS faults.

I mean, it seems to me that Yavin was just too central for such a remote little rock.

Grim Fantango
19 June 2005, 06:25 PM
It's a coin toss, Dalla, or Jacen Solo, I hate them both...with a passion

BrianDavion
19 June 2005, 10:52 PM
It's a coin toss, Dalla, or Jacen Solo, I hate them both...with a passion

I'd go with Dalla then, Jacen at least has succeeded at stuff so whatever you think of him, he isn't INCOMPETANT.

Daala is a solid example of why nepotism is a bad way to manage things

Ronen Tal-Ravis
20 June 2005, 02:04 AM
The evil overlord from "Crystal Star" he was incompetent and boring as well...

Grim Fantango
20 June 2005, 06:27 PM
Originally posted by BrianDavion

Jacen at least has succeeded at stuff


So did dalla, but Jacen did nothing worth while, just was there, I swear they shoulda killed him and kept Anakin.

Commie bastard plot...and yes, I will hold this grudge to my grave.

CaamasiJedi49
20 June 2005, 08:16 PM
Originally posted by Grim Fantango


So did dalla, but Jacen did nothing worth while, just was there, I swear they shoulda killed him and kept Anakin.

Commie bastard plot...and yes, I will hold this grudge to my grave.

Relax their Grim, we beat the communist 14 years. You should be more worried about the Hutts. You didn't here it from me, but the Hutts may have had a hand it it. But if any Nikto ask, you didn't hear it from me.

Caamasi jedi49

BrianDavion
21 June 2005, 01:33 AM
Jacen did stuff, not much and what he did do he was sucessful at it Daala.. well.. she united the warring forces of the deep core, but thats about the ONLY success she's had.

ohh right and she whiped out a poor defenceless coloney on dantooine

PsychoInfiltrator
21 June 2005, 10:11 AM
Some wise human once told me: "Its amazing how much bad writing and poor research must be fixed up by good Star wars authors like Stackpole and Zahn. And yet they do it quite well and still write amazing books that many non-Star Wars fans still enjoy reading. If the bad authors stopped writing Star Wars books, imagine what these geniuses could do then?"

Oh, BTW, since Daala and KJA are overvoted, I'm going with MacIntire and Hambly.

Garan
21 June 2005, 12:15 PM
I have to second that, I found it pretty funny the I,Jedi spent half the book just fixing the muck-up the Jedi Academy had left behind and actually managed to get more story about what happened on Yavin across then the orginal book series itself. :D

Most incompetent hmm.... that Muun Admiral from Jedi Trial (though maybe he get more able once I try to finsih the book). :rolleyes:

Daala did at least one good thing. She handed over enough power to Gilad so he became the new leader of the Remnant. :D

Drayqson
21 June 2005, 05:06 PM
So far, I agree on Admiral Daala being hugely pointless and incompetent. My god was she annoying, in the end I find that the best stuff from KJA is what other authors did with his ideas (Stackpole, Kyp in the NJO, etc.)
However, I might point out Warlord Zsinj. Though he was in the exceptionally good X-wing novels, he was still "Just some guy with a Super Star Destroyer." Seriously, he was some upstart with a lot of firepower. I'd be more scared of Thrawn with a dilapidated spice freighter.
Also, my equally Star Wars nerdy family comments on how much they hate Borsk Fey'lya, but I'm not sure if that qualifies as incompetence.

BrianDavion
21 June 2005, 05:29 PM
I think incompetant is really a matter of dependsd. Daal is poorly thought of cause she was incompetant but built up like such a dangerous foe.

Zssjjinni, yeah he was just a thug with a SSD, he was clever but not exceptionally so. but he wasn't well.. over rated...

wolfe
21 June 2005, 05:39 PM
incompetence in the EU? hmm
and so much incompetence to choose from.

Wedge in Red2
22 June 2005, 04:00 AM
Originally posted by Drayqson

However, I might point out Warlord Zsinj. Though he was in the exceptionally good X-wing novels, he was still "Just some guy with a Super Star Destroyer." Seriously, he was some upstart with a lot of firepower. I'd be more scared of Thrawn with a dilapidated spice freighter.


I don't agree with that. I don't really think Zsinj was incompetant. Sure, he was no Thrawn. But he had some solid tactics, and pulled off some nice deceptions.

Jon

Garan
22 June 2005, 05:26 AM
He created the Raptors (far scarier then stormtroopers), tones of special projects, he used mercs ( he gets a few bonus points for that because one of my chars once works as one of his pirates ^^), he had Melvar ( ;) ), plus he managed to hold about 1/3-1/4 of the Galaxy for a while. Really not that incompetent. :)

Drayqson
22 June 2005, 03:16 PM
Fair enough. I haven't read X-wing in a while. As it goes, most of the villains in the EU were scrounging through the Emperor's leftovers to be a threat to anyone. That is, up until the Vong and exempting the Ssi-ruu. The Imperial remnant is still just a remnant. Some did well with what they had (Thrawn of course, and his succesor Pellaeon come to mind.)
Much agreement with Garan, about the only thing Daala did right was gather power for Gilad.

Ronen Tal-Ravis
22 June 2005, 11:44 PM
I think the Vong, Anor, was pretty weak as well. Not one of his plans actually worked and he was constantly winding to get out of his superiors' hands and blame others. I never liked him at all, more the opposite.

wolverine
23 June 2005, 12:59 AM
Originally posted by Garan
He created the Raptors (far scarier then stormtroopers), tones of special projects, he used mercs ( he gets a few bonus points for that because one of my chars once works as one of his pirates ^^), he had Melvar ( ;) ), plus he managed to hold about 1/3-1/4 of the Galaxy for a while. Really not that incompetent. :)

Yup. And he alomost wipped out han and his battle group, TWICE....

Then you also get project Moort, and that other one (the empions and those droids)...

Zardnaar
18 July 2005, 02:33 AM
Zsinj isn't incompetant. Not great but he held his own for a while and it took the Imps and NR to off him.

Jonas Malcume
21 July 2005, 04:12 AM
Krueller was incompetent.
Daala was incompetent.
And most of all ...........NORM ANOR was the most incompetent character ever. His plans never work and he screws up constantly. He over all is the worst.

Garan
21 July 2005, 05:00 AM
Hm… well he did fine in the beginning and he seems very good at messing with the “weak minded”. I mean he blew up a Mon Cal Cruiser with a ancient space missile, poisoned Mara Jade, got the peace brigade going, caused the fall of Duro, founded his own heretic movement etc.. He just got screwed over a bit when the Jedi got in his path. ;)

Kyndig_Episte
30 July 2005, 01:42 AM
Dalla's problem was, she was working with tactics that were 10 years old and known to most people in the galaxy, especially Ackbar. I thought that Dalla was a good character but could've been much better if she had been written by a better author. She never really got to do anything except lose. I can understand failing every once in a awhile, but c'mon, every time? Kevin J. Anderson should've made her more adaptive from the begining instead of having to learn it later in her life. Once she found out the her tactics were obselete she should've joined up with Palleon and taken one the galaxy with a much larger force during the events from the Jedi Acadamy books. Then she would have been a formidible foe, worthy of a good Star Wars novel.

I really hated the Fallanassi from the Black Fleet Crisis. I thought the whole White Current stuff was boring, stupid, and pretty much pointless. All it really did was prove that there was another viewpoint of the force, which is something that people already knew could happen but didn't really need to be told. If the author had left that part of the story out I think the books would have been that much better.

darkforcerising
22 August 2005, 10:22 AM
I would have to say that one guy with the huge chin and pink ship who visits the Ewoks in that one issue of Star Wars Tales. And of course, stormtroopers. They're always incompetent.


So did dalla, but Jacen did nothing worth while, just was there, I swear they shoulda killed him and kept Anakin.

Side note: If you read the interview on the "Vector Prime" e-book they talk about how Jacen was originally the Solo child to die but GL changed it. GL said he didn't want too many Anakins running around, people might get confused. So NJO Anakin gets whacked. It was GL, not the commies.

Grim Fantango
8 September 2005, 01:01 PM
What, he diod, they coulda kept anakin.......MOTHER%&@$#@S!!!!! Thats how it shoulda been......%&#%#&&%#$%$%##&^#$%%&!!!

Nova Spice
8 September 2005, 10:25 PM
Hm… well he did fine in the beginning and he seems very good at messing with the “weak minded”. I mean he blew up a Mon Cal Cruiser with a ancient space missile, poisoned Mara Jade, got the peace brigade going, caused the fall of Duro, founded his own heretic movement etc.. He just got screwed over a bit when the Jedi got in his path.

Agreed, Nom Anor did well enough. Some of his plans succeeded. Some of his plans failed. It just so happens that the most memorable of his plans were the ones that failed. :P

He was far from incompetent. Someone that cunning is the antithesis of incompetence. ;)

Admiral Piett
9 September 2005, 05:16 PM
I personally belive that Borsk Fey'la was bu far the stupidist and most arogant EU character ever. And I persoanlly belive that all bothans seem to caus eproblems except Krey'fey, but he isnt perfect either.

Wedge in Red2
12 September 2005, 06:05 AM
Originally posted by Grim Fantango
What, he diod, they coulda kept anakin.......MOTHER%&@$#@S!!!!! Thats how it shoulda been......%&#%#&&%#$%$%##&^#$%%&!!!

Um, due to lack of quoting, I have no idea who or what you're referring to. I'm guessing Nom Anor, or one of the Vong, due to the reference to Anakin. However, your post is not particularly coherant. You might like to clarify.

Regards,

Jon
Moderator

gmjabreson
22 September 2005, 06:05 AM
I'm surprised nobody talked about Sate Prestage. The Emperors own advisor. He let Isard walk all over him, acted like a brainwashed idiot and was later captured and killed by the ruling council of the empire remnant.

tauchiss
29 April 2006, 12:29 PM
Actually, Isard was incompetant in the Bacta war, she used stupid tactics, and lost a SSD to 2 squads of fighters, and a Dozen Freighters, 1 SSD $ 1'000'000'000'000'000, the combined price of the opposers, $100'000'000. I also thought Non Amor was a blubbering Incompetant fool, but what about that guy who desined Darksasber and the Death Star, you have to be very incompatent to be executed not one, or two, or even three, but SEVEN!!! times, or what about the hive mind of the Tuaril, they ruined the Darksaber, but the worst of all, General Skander or something, the supply officer 3rd class, who pretended to be a general, from Darksaber

Ubiqtorate
29 April 2006, 10:30 PM
I'm going to add my voice to those who have voted for Kevin J. Anderson as the most incompetent. Fortunately, the EU was not left entirely in his hands. Look at what he did to Dune!

Garan
10 May 2006, 05:32 AM
Actually, Isard was incompetant in the Bacta war, she used stupid tactics, and lost a SSD to 2 squads of fighters, and a Dozen Freighters, 1 SSD $ 1'000'000'000'000'000, the combined price of the opposers, $100'000'000.

Not to forget she got two of here SDs stolen ;), though she at least admitted to having been out of her mind at the time and proved competent and scheming otherwise. That short story series staring Isard in one of Tales books was pretty nice in that respect as were Isards revenge, the comics and the first two x-wing books.

but what about that guy who desined Darksasber and the Death Star, you have to be very incompatent to be executed not one, or two, or even three, but SEVEN!!! times, or what about the hive mind of the Tuaril, they ruined the Darksaber

Well Bevel most certainly was brilliant in doing what he was told to do, you cant really blame him for the people using his stuff not being all to successful with them.

Uron Teff
10 May 2006, 01:55 PM
Originally posted by Garan
Well Bevel most certainly was brilliant in doing what he was told to do, you cant really blame him for the people using his stuff not being all to successful with them.

Well, Bevel Lemelisk was all but stupid, that's for sure. But he was also more than naivè. I mean, c'mon, a Superlaser with the power to destroy entire planets in a gargantuan Spacestation and he accepted the answer "it's all for mining purposes".
Naivè boy, this Bevel was. ;)

Pel
12 May 2006, 01:12 AM
I didn't gather any naivete from Bevel Lemelisk in Darksaber, just a great wish for it all to finally end. He seemed quite content when he died for the last time. Can't say I blame him.

Anyway, on with my vote:

Nom Anor. That guy botched everything he tried. About the only thing he really succeeded in doing was terminally angering the Jedi and alienating all his Vong buddies. Oh well, each time I thought the Jedi had him he managed to escape in classic arch villain style. At least he had that going for him. :)

Jaden_Core11
20 May 2006, 10:36 PM
The most incompentent person in the whole Star Wars series that I've ever read or played is Rosh Pennin, becuase he tried to kill Jaden,and Kyle while he was at it, Got Sith brainwashed, got his arm chopped off and then passed out in Jaden's hands while he was like still being an idiot. Did I forget to mention that he was also nearly killed by Jaden! So my argument that Rosh Pennin is incompentint and also an absolute dummy while he is at it! ....... GOOOOO BOBBA FETT:boba: :sabersml:

Uron Teff
25 May 2006, 02:44 AM
After re-reading The New-Rebellion I have to admit that Kueller is the most incompetent Expanded Universe character I've ever seen. He might have possessed some wicked new Dark Side powers but he still had no real villany-character as Skywalker opponent.

Ravnor
8 June 2006, 01:04 AM
the most incopotent charicters were every single Ewok to walk the face of Endor!

Uron Teff
8 June 2006, 02:15 AM
Originally posted by Ravnor
the most incopotent charicters were every single Ewok to walk the face of Endor!

First of all, the Ewoks beat the hell out of, what?, two Imperial regiments? And furthermore, the question of this thread is who the most icompetet Expanded Uiverse character is. Now Ewoks, as far as I know, are a part of Episode VI: Return of the Jedi. And therefore I have to say that they are not really EU from my point of view (although there are some EU ad Ifineties stories with them).

Darth Jerrod
8 June 2006, 06:29 AM
Every character and I will take this one step futher, situation, created by Kevin J Anderson and his band of ragtag star wars authors over at Bantam Books royally sucked.

I saw this because... well they sucked. We got characters like Daala and Kyp and places like the MAW and the Sun Crusher and well yes everything and anything in those books.

But Xwing series of books is spared. Zahns books too, while I am no longer a fan of how he altered the Force Spirits his books did jumpstart the whole EU

BillyBoysPie
8 June 2006, 05:52 PM
must agree with daala. ts been awhile since ive read anything star wars in nature, however, she does stand out as incopentent.

Treefrog
21 June 2006, 04:53 AM
Originally posted by Ubiqtorate
I'm going to add my voice to those who have voted for Kevin J. Anderson as the most incompetent. Fortunately, the EU was not left entirely in his hands. Look at what he did to Dune!

Actually I enjoyed the Dune prequel novels.... And as far as KJA being in control, you have to realize that Brian Hebert (the son of the creator) also cowrote these novels with him.....

Ravnor
21 June 2006, 11:04 AM
Originally posted by Treefrog


Actually I enjoyed the Dune prequel novels.... And as far as KJA being in control, you have to realize that Brian Hebert (the son of the creator) also cowrote these novels with him.....

I'm with Treefrog on this one, Dune prequel novels explained a hell of a lot of the background that the origionals had missed.

PsychoInfiltrator
7 August 2006, 02:43 PM
I was perusing some stuff here on SWRPGN-in this case, an editorial of Gamer issues 1 through 4-and came across this, by our very own Moridin...


Then there's issue #3, which I will argue is the best issue yet. Finally we get stats for the short story (which, though written by Kevin J. Anderson, the worst writer in all of Star Wars, is a good lead-in to the head honcho of the Sith order),

It ain't necessarily just some of us rank-and-file people who don't like his writing.