PDA

View Full Version : Vader and the Droids



Tem_Starrunner
23 February 2008, 10:22 PM
I was thinking the other day what were the effects of Artoo and Threepio on Vader. The first example of the droids affect on Vader is in Empire where for some reason after Threepio's parts are dumped in the smelting room, recovered by chewbacca, then taken into Imperial custody they are returned to the Rebels.

Did Vader (like in the Tales story Thank The Maker!) feel sorry for Threepio because of his past connection to the protocal droid he built (not knowing they were one and same). Or what if in the off chance he realized it was his Threepio, after all Threepio was a custom job and would have some telltale signs of his maker. Giving Threepio back to the heros would have saved him, otherwise he would have been dismantled for information and then scrapped.

The second is in A New Hope during the trench run where Vader hits Artoo (another trusted droid friend). On screen time between Vader hitting Artoo and going for his second shot is over twenty seconds(I understand screen time and in movie time isn't the same). It strikes me that Vader stopped short of shooting Luke down after hitting Artoo. Could Vader have hesitated because he recall his time with Artoo (not realizing it was the same droid) and took longer to take his second shot at Luke. Honestly though the scene is pretty open for interpation.

Just my ponderings.

Fingon
23 February 2008, 10:35 PM
I think he did, with 3PO, at least. R2 really didn't have much to distinguish himself from any other R2 unit, and Vader wouldn't have gotten a good look at him anyway.

I can see Vader looking at 3PO, beginning to remember his past and then violently smashing those memories, ordering a nearby lackey to deliver the pieces to the hostages. It seems like something he would do.

Ubiqtorate
24 February 2008, 06:01 AM
This is probably the boring version, but I don't think Vader made connections in either of those cases. Threepio was just another protocol droid, like the thousands Anakin had probably worked with since becoming Vader. Threepio was dismantled and scrapped, after all - whether or not his information was downloaded isn't said. Everybody was just lucky Chewie managed to pull him form the pile before he got dumped.

As far as Vader's shot after hitting Artoo - well, there was a lot of smoke after that hit, and it may have jammed the Dark Lord's firing controls. He couldn't get a clear shot through all of that smoke, and had to wait for it to clear before taking his next shot.

Admiral Zaarin
24 February 2008, 03:02 PM
I agree with Ubiqtorate; I don't think Vader had any sentimental attachments to droids. It took his son to pull any feeling out of him, after all.

boccelounge
24 February 2008, 03:23 PM
I buy what Ubi's selling too... but as the OP mentions, there was a great short story in the Star Wars: Tales comic regarding Vader and Threepio. I believe it was issue #6; I have it in volume 2 of the tradepaper collection.

Finding the dismantled droid causes Vader to recall flashbacks of young Anakin building the droid.

The story ends with Shmi telling Anakin "Just remember, the droid is your responsibility. And unless you're prepared to care for something... you don't deserve to have it."

Then it flashes forward to Vader holding Threepio's head and an Imperial officer asking "Shall I have the technicians search its memory? Or... would you rather have the Ugnaughts smelt the thing. Sir?"

Vader pauses, then replies "The droid's parts carry the stench of Captain Solo's copilot. Deliver this box to the Wookiee's cell."

The officer replies "I... forgive me, sir. I don't understand. You... want the prisoner to have the droid?"

Vader simply says "I am giving the Wookiee what he deserves."


So, while I totally buy that Vader may have had no recollection of Threepio at all, I rather prefer this explanation-- it hints at a little of "Anakin" still left in Vader-- which is of course the theme of RotJ-- and it nicely explains why Threepio was returned to Chewie.

But don't worry, you "canon" nuts-- the SW: Tales stories are not all considered part of the main SW continuity. So everybody can safely believe what they want. ;)


Ah, and thanks to trusty ol' Google...


http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b228/boccelounge/Holonet/starwars_tales_6.jpg

FULONGAMER
24 February 2008, 03:42 PM
Another example of their interaction can be found in the Splinter of the Mind's Eye novel, that has the distinction of being written well before the foreknowledge that Anakin built 3PO (or even that Vader WAS Anakin) .

Set after ANH and before ESB when Vader closes in on the heroes out in the swamps of Mimban, he encounters both droids alone (guarding the vehicle) and shuts them down with verbal command overrides, rather than simply cutting them down or crushing them. Was this sentimentality? Was he intending to collect his droids back? Who knows?

Anakin/Vader's sentimentality has always been his weakness. He forms attachments that supercede his better judgement, and drive him to reckless and impulsive action. This is as true for the Droids as it was for pada-wada-PandaBear...whatever. :hansolo:

boccelounge
24 February 2008, 03:55 PM
Originally posted by FULONGAMER
Anakin/Vader's sentimentality has always been his weakness. He forms attachments that supercede his better judgement, and drive him to reckless and impulsive action...
Very true. But this trait is what also, ultimately, makes him an interesting character. This is of course the central theme of the whole Saga-- we are introduced to this death's-head-mask, monolithically evil monster, then gradually shown the human being inside. So that's why, after some initial "raised eyebrows" at the Anakin-Droids history introduced in Ep1, I've gradually come to see that this is vital part of the whole Saga/Anakin story.

But... citing Splinter? That's hard to do... after the Holiday Special and anything written by KJA, that book has to be the worst of the "EU" fiction...

;)

zappo inc
24 February 2008, 04:37 PM
and just what precisely is the 'best' of the eu fiction, pray? Don't they teach ya not to throw stones in mod school?

Fulongamer has an excellent point relating to the thread, and you toss off a nice little whisp of flame like that?

Oh, and i doubt the whole point of the movies was to show the humanity inside the inhuman monster, but that is of course my opinion...

FULONGAMER
24 February 2008, 05:13 PM
Originally posted by boccelounge


But... citing Splinter? That's hard to do... after the Holiday Special and anything written by KJA, that book has to be the worst of the "EU" fiction...

;)

Did I miss a memo somewhere? Holiday Special and the KJA ramblings I'll give you, but for the longest time, Splinter was the only respected fragment of the hit-n-miss support the SWU even had between the first two movies. All there was other than it were the Marvel Comics (wich have taken decades to earn back their rightly deserved respect) and the Daly Han solo and Lando Calrissian novel trilogies which have received far less consideratuion than they deserve.

What's not to like about Splinter? It has all kinds of excellent SW points in it, interesting aliens (Coynites, Mimbanites, Yuzzem), heartless Imperials, proto-sibling makeouts ( :leia: almost :lukejedi: ), explorations in the Force and its uses and abuses, and quite the kewl lightsaber battle, between Vader and Leia no less. Harbingers of things to come and in addition to the aforementioned Droids elements, surprisingly prophetic of elements not even imagined much less revealed as of its publishing. I thought it bore up under the burden well.

boccelounge
24 February 2008, 06:25 PM
Originally posted by FULONGAMER
Did I miss a memo somewhere? ...
What's not to like about Splinter? It has all kinds of excellent SW points in it... I thought it bore up under the burden well.
Well, OK-- maybe I'll give it a third chance then. I read it, I dunno, 20+ plus years ago and loved it, simply because it was Star Wars. But I re-read it a few years ago (post Ep1) and thought it pretty corny, considering all the excellent movie and EU stuff that's followed. Not that I blame the author; he simply had not much to go on regarding the SW universe...



Originally posted by zappo inc
and just what precisely is the 'best' of the eu fiction, pray? Don't they teach ya not to throw stones in mod school?

Fulongamer has an excellent point relating to the thread, and you toss off a nice little whisp of flame like that?
No, not at all! "Flaming" was never my intention-- hence the " ;) ".

I really do agree with Fulon in this regard, with the caveat that I think the "weakness" he mentions is actually Vader's greatest strength. The "Splinter" bit was just a joke. Honest. ;)



Originally posted by zappo inc
Oh, and i doubt the whole point of the movies was to show the humanity inside the inhuman monster, but that is of course my opinion...
Well, in that we plainly disagree. After Ep3, Lucas has made it clear that the theme of the entire Saga is the fall and subsequent redemption of Anakin. Something about a "Chosen One" prophecy, as I recall... And personally I thought that was obvious. But no matter-- if you enjoy SW, then enjoy it as you will. :)


EDIT: As for "good" EU fiction, I guess I'd start with the Daley's Solo trilogy, and the Lando trilogy, mentioned above, and move onto the first Zahn trilogy, and (some) of the Marvel and Darkhorse comics. I quite liked the Stackpole Rogue Squadron stuff too. IMHO, of course.

But I digress... lest we get too off-topic.

Admiral Zaarin
25 February 2008, 06:48 PM
and just what precisely is the 'best' of the eu fiction, pray? Don't they teach ya not to throw stones in mod school?
I think many will agree with me when I say, "Anything by Timothy Zahn." :)