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Kayle Skolaris
2 January 2002, 04:05 AM
I've heard this is listed somewhere in The Far Orbit Project, but so help me I cannot find it ANYWHERE. Could someone direct me to a page number or something? Failing that, could you tell me the price of a Neb-B?

Deck
2 January 2002, 05:11 AM
<p align=justify>Hehe, this information is well hidden in the book <i>The Far Orbit Project</i>. However, you can find it on page 126, second paragraph. There you get to know that a Nebulon-B Frigate costs about 9 million credits. :)</p>

Rigo
2 January 2002, 09:57 AM
I know that we already do a topic on the subject but dont rember what is the name.

At my opignon, the nebulon B cost around 194 million, my source is in the commando shantipole adventure(the adventure where you have the B-wing.) i chose this option because that if a ship cost not hight some ppl (pirate etc) buy it too easly, Corelian corvette cost around 3 million, but it is an old designe and it is no primary an military ships.

It is difficult to say excatly what is the coast of a ship, if a rember i see in planet collection the Prosperpine crusier, around 12 million and he more powerfull that a N-B. but we may not just take the size and the weapon for chose a price, but also the equipiment special feature etc(the N-B have Hangart for fighter, lot of space for his crew, big engine room etc........)


I see also the 9 million in the project far orbit, but in my opignon it is not the reel cost, if you see some capture take by pirate, in some sourcebook etc, have a value Far superior to 9 million and they will paie the ship in one capture?! . I prefer to take the 194 million.

If somone rember the other topic, pls put a link in this one.

this may help everybody;)

Deck
2 January 2002, 10:33 AM
<p align=justify>Yes, I <i>do</i> remember the topic. It was a thread about capital ship prices. You can acces it here:

<a href="http://holonet.swrpgnetwork.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2213">Price of Capital Ships</a>

And yes, I also know of the price listed in the <i>Shantipole Adventure</i>. This price about 194 million credits could be possible, but if you compare the prices of other capital ships, the 194 million credits don't fit in the chart. They probably revised the costs, as <i>Shantipole</i> was a first Edition Adventure. Because when you look at the 2nd Edition adventure which has been upgraded for <i>Classic Adventure Vol. 5</i>, the passage about the price of the frigate has been cut out.</p><b>Examples:</b>
<li>Prosperity-class Light Cruiser (300 m) - 12 million</li>
<li>Bayonet-class Light Cruiser (200 m) - 5 million</li>
<li>Nova-class Battle Cruiser (400 m) - 15 million</li>
<li>Corellian Corvette (150 m) - 3.5 million</li>
<li>Corellian Gunship (120 m) - 4.8 million</li>
<li>Asteroid Mining Ship (350 m) - 8 million</li>
<li>Atmospheric Gas Mining Ship (300 m) - 7.5 million</li>
<li>Class-7 Repair Vessel (560 m) - 4.5 million</li>
<li>Mag V Mining Vessel (542 m) - 5 million</li>
<li>Bacta Transport (238 m) - 1.2 million</li>

<li>Nebulon-B Frigate (300 m) - 9 million</li>
This does fit well in the examples above! :)
<p align=justify>I do however know about two other "Too High Prices". These are from the 2 Tapani starships from the <i>Lords of the Expanse Boxed Set</i>. They are the only two ships out of all WEG books, that don't fit in the price chart, besides the 1st Ed. Nebulon-B. frigate.</p>

Kayle Skolaris
2 January 2002, 10:51 AM
Considering the preoccupation with looks and style that the Tapani Noble Houses tend to obsess over, the Tapani frigates and fighters may well be gilded with incredibly expensive materials that drive up the price precipitously.

Out of curiousity, what's the price for a Nebulon-B in 1st Edition?

Deck
2 January 2002, 11:36 AM
Originally posted by Kayle Skolaris
Out of curiousity, what's the price for a Nebulon-B in 1st Edition?

Didn't you read <b>Rigo's post</b>? He said it there. 194 million credits.

Kayle Skolaris
2 January 2002, 12:11 PM
Oh! I thought SFS was a 2E adventure.

POST UPDATE: Eh, nevermind... I see what the deal is. I really should learn to read rather than skim.

Fred Getce
2 January 2002, 04:03 PM
Ok lets be realistic about the costs of interstellar starships. WEG and a google of other such games have stupid ass costs for these massive ships. look at this http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/military_f14.html a F-14 Tomcat costs 38 million, is 18.6 meters long and we got people posting cargo haulers that travel at speeds greater than that of light, costing a fraction of the price for one Tomcat and they are hundredds of metres in length.

Let's get realistic people.

Here is my take. Keep in mind I still have yet to complete my starship book which will include such details for Star Wars using random modifier system (Babylon 5 system).

Corellian Corvette 1.2 billion
Corellian Gunship 1.5 billion
Nebulon-B Frigate 2.5 billion
Imperial Star Destroyer 25 billion
Super Star Destroyer 220 trillion

MC 80 20 billion
Carrack Cruiser 8.5 billion
Cargo Container 20 million

X-Wing Fighter 40 million
Y-Wing Fighter 38 million
A-Wing Fighter 30 million
B-Wing Fighter 54 million

TIE fighter 15 million
TIE Interceptor 20 million
TIE Bomber 25 million
TIE Advanced 55 million

Ghtroc Freighter 320 million
YT-1300 Freighter 300 million

These are more realistic to what the prices should be.

Kayle Skolaris
2 January 2002, 05:10 PM
PCs in my campaigns frequently find themselves in possession of obscene amounts of money since they're rather clever and resourceful when it comes to acquiring credits. As a result there's only one ship class in my game that doesn't have a price listed. Even a 15 mile long Archangel-class Super Star Carrier has a listed price (45.6 quadrillion credits, not including the 7,200 squadrons of fighters, bombers, and gunships that it carries).

Emperor Xanderich II
3 January 2002, 04:14 AM
Originally posted by Fred Getce

These are more realistic to what the prices should be.

Maybe, but maybe not. In our world, how many companies can build Tomcats and Eurofighters, not many. How many can build them in Star Wars, millions I expect.

Thus the price may not be as silly as it first seems.

And I think they want to try to keep the figures realistic. Billions are large units. Also they're different depending where in the world you are. Stupid I know...:(

So-Var Leet
3 January 2002, 06:49 AM
Not only that, but currency could be worth more in the Star Wars universe. I.E. less inflation.

That would also account for the monetary difference.

Kayle Skolaris
4 January 2002, 01:23 AM
The real telling point here is that F-14s, F-18s, Eurofighters, Joint Strike Fighters or whatever can ONLY be legally purchased by government agencies. Bill Gates could buy himself a full carrier battlegroup w/ fighters and ammunition plus crews to man them all with his personal fortune but he CAN'T because it's blatantly illegal. Military equipment almost ALWAYS costs more than it would if it were available to the civilian market.

On the other hand, a Corellian Corvette, or even a Corellian Gunship (a vessel with no possible civilian application by modern Earth standards) are completely legal for private citizens to own. Basically, if it has a price tag, a private citizen can buy one in Star Wars. That's why some seemingly innocuous items like Stormtrooper Armor is illegal to purchase and has no listed purchase price. Despite the fact that there are better armor types out there available for civilian purchase, this particular piece of equipment is military issue only.

Thomson
4 January 2002, 05:46 AM
An ISD II costs 145,670,000 according to SotG.

Starships are incredibly cheap in SW.

Kayle Skolaris
4 January 2002, 06:36 AM
At that price Bill Gates (who is currently worth over 45.4 billion dollars) could purchase 12 ISD II's, stock each with 72 TIE Defenders, and pay each person required to fully crew those ISDs (including gunners and troops) for the six years an ISD II carries consumables for and have 3,057,776,238 dollars left over to purchase escort craft with.

Gulmyros
4 January 2002, 08:35 AM
Assuming, of course, that 1 credit = 1 dollar. And would that be US dollar, or Canadian? :D

But who's to say how galactic economics really work?? Why, the GM, that's who.

Want your players to buy a capital ship? Make money available. Heck, even change laws in some systems. You're the GM.

Don't want your players to buy a capital ship? Make money scarce. Lower the pay for cargo runs. Steal their ship. Whatever it takes. You're the GM.

I guess I'm just on the other side of the fence, tho. When I want dramatic, fast, cinematic plots and action, I play StarWars. When I want to keep track of micro- and macroeconomics, I play DnD.

So ignore me if you want, after all, you're the GM.

I won't be offended. B)

Gully

GMSarli
4 January 2002, 10:55 AM
Originally posted by Fred Getce
Ok lets be realistic about the costs of interstellar starships. WEG and a google of other such games have stupid ass costs for these massive ships.

Actually, I always looked at it this way: A YT-1300 costs 100,000 credits. That's not too far off from the dollar cost of an eighteen wheeler. Both carry cargo from point A to point B and both can be owned by civilians, so I figured the best way to conceptualize the costs ISN'T as naval vessels, but as trucks, humvees, buses, tanks, etc.

Of course, we don't build ground vehicles that hold 37,085 crew, but that's the fundamental problem with analogies -- analogies are only good for wrapping your mind around something, to give you a "handle" to grip the concept. If you try to extend an analogy past that point, it loses its usefulness. In this case, the cost of a YT-1300 "makes sense" if you think of it as analogous to a semi, another civilian contract cargo hauler. And then you should *stop* and just think of things relative to the YT-1300 (instead of the prices of other Earth vehicles relative to trucks).

The costs of production of a massive starship, by the way, would go down considerably as the energy and labor required becomes cheaper (droids are cheap, fusion is cheap, and energy MUST be cheap to be able to afford to put a 1.6-km-long ISD into hyperspace). Add this to the fact that you don't know how many credits = a dollar, and there are just too many unknowns to say that the pricing system is completely off. I lean toward giving them the benefit of the doubt.

Fred Getce
4 January 2002, 06:19 PM
Originally posted by Fred Getce
Ghtroc Freighter 320 million
YT-1300 Freighter 300 million

The freighter prices are off from my notes major.

They should be...

Ghtroc Freighter 3.2 million
YT-1300 Freighter 3 million

This is one of the reasons most smugglers have crime lords buy there ships for them, they than perform smuggling runs to pay off the crime lords (ofcourse teh crime lords usually make a 500% profit from this).

I believe a Imperial and for that matter a Republic credit has a fixed rate (changing in its worth based on inflation like the American dollar) and you could pay the costs in another currency that has a better exchange rate or a poor exchange rate if one wanted to.

Plus there are civillian craft that could be purchased that would allow for interstellar travel (but slower than standard hyperdrive ratings) new for 100,000+ credits but they would be unarmed with out shields. However used ships are a different matter all together (price is based on seller and than haggling it down by the buyer). Plus I met the guys were helped to write the SW 2nd Ed. R&E book. The prices are as is so players CAN buy such things as there own fighter crafts and capital ships (at least those that have a price and are not NAS. While I give them full marks for actually putting out a RPG game and stuff, I have a severe problem with their PC are heroic can't die by a common thug and being awarded with more money than a hutt shoudl know what to do with.

I guess my group and me demand more realism in our games now and days.

PS: By the way my Chivalry and Sorcery campaign I set on Earth in Germany during the Hohenstaufen Dynasty has racked up 5 player character deaths in about 4.5 months. God I am a killing GM. :evilgrin: 8o

shinyhalo
17 August 2004, 08:08 AM
Actually, I always looked at it this way: A YT-1300 costs 100,000 credits. That's not too far off from the dollar cost of an eighteen wheeler. Both carry cargo from point A to point B and both can be owned by civilians, so I figured the best way to conceptualize the costs ISN'T as naval vessels, but as trucks, humvees, buses, tanks, etc.

I agree with this general philosophy. Many of the WoTC stats fit into this general range:

Military Diminutive (TIE) 60k
Military Tiny (X-wing) 150k
Military Small (Guardian) 200k, (Firespray) 220k, (Citadel) 250k
Military Medium (Republic Cruiser) 850k, (Vibre) 2.3m
Military Large Corvette 3.5m, Corellian Gunship 4.8m, Imperial Customs Cruiser 5m
Military Huge Nebulon B 19m, Carrack 19m, Star Galleon 17.5m
Military Gargantuan Acclamator 29m, Victory 57m
Military Colossal ISD 146m

Civilian Small (YT 1300) 100k
Civilian Medium (Gallofree) 350k
Civilian Large Star Seeder 1m
Civilian Huge 5m
Civilian Gargantuan 10m
Civilian Colossal 30m

Luxury Small - PLY 3000 (stock version lady luck) 1m
Luxury Large - Ubrikkian Yacht 4.5m

So yes, the Nebulon B price of 9m is too low when you compare it to the Carrack and Star Galleon. I recommend 19m for it.
If we say the average employed sentient earns 20k credits per year then he/she can save up enough to start a small transport business in a realistic amount of time.

t_potega
27 August 2004, 04:52 PM
You all seem to forget about one think in "ANH" when Solo tells that his price is 10000cr(?? dont remember) luke says that he almost could buy his own ship, so by me prices from sourcebooks are pretty high. yt-1300(design about 50 years old new are not made now- there is new model YT-2400) should cost not more than
25000 cr (of course it depends on state of ship: modified(40k), damaged(max 15k), wreck-for parts(5k), stock(25k), and so on and they affects price),
As for starfighters it should depend on era played: before empire they were easier to buy,
during Empire very limited.
Also depends on sector - where are characters are. (fighters are military vessels price for craft, price for licences, permits ....etc- one starfightem might cost more than 10 YT freighters )

Cap-ships lets assume that smaller (max 400m) may be purchased by civilians (horribly high prices), byt these are demobilized ships, often their heavy weaponry is removed (turbolasers are illegal), only ion cannons, shields, sensors(outdated), engines left. CC is pretty old design and should cost ABOUT 5 000 000 cr.


Nebulon -B frigate - about 10 000 000 cr



I like equal sums:D

wolfe
28 August 2004, 02:18 PM
wow a resurrected thread...

little problem with your cap size..
you would be limiting the larger cargo vessels, passenger liners to government/military use only.
military vessels would already be under a restricted sales standard.

demilitarizing vessels may include removing or replacing the combat capability with lower grade equipment.
replacing would keep the cost conscience from having to add equipment,and if you have to add equipment might as well add combat grade..