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View Full Version : Which Force powers could affect the Vong?



Jedi_Starwind
18 January 2002, 09:27 AM
I remember somewhere on this board someone said that you could use a modified Force Grip. What would need to be modified? and am I correct that Force Lightning is able to damage them? If so what other powers do you all think would be able to affect them. Dark or Light.

Silberpfeil
19 January 2002, 08:23 AM
Anything that doesn't directly mess with the Vongs but alters the surroundings. You can create a bubble empty of air around the Vong's head as Tahiri did, you can throw rocks or other stuff, tekelinetic push work too. You can grip them or crush them by affecting pression directly to the air around them. That's just a few examples.

Corsair
20 January 2002, 10:10 PM
Also remember, if your PCs go around calling the Yuuzhan Vong .. The Vong ...its like THE ultimate insult to the Yuuzhan Vong. So, if you faced a Yuuzhan Vong and said something to the effect of "You Vong suck" .. he/she wouldnt spare a second (well .. they might say back to you "You infidel. You know nothing.") and attack you.

But I digress.

Force powers do not directly affect the Yuuzhan Vong. Anakin may have been able to do a few things but that is only because he could "sense" the Yuuzhan Vong whenever he was holding his modified lightsaber (read Conquest and Rebirth).

Tem_Starrunner
24 January 2002, 07:47 AM
YOu can affect the Vong with the Force by not directing it at them. NO mental attacks work, no physical attacks work the way they do with another race (it's like aiming blind or pawing around in the dark). Force lightening or telekinesis would still work.

Rule of thumb you can't directly attack a Vong with the Force. You can attack them with the results of the Force.

Moose
30 January 2002, 10:46 PM
I agree that you can not directly attack the Vong with the force and that you could telekentic powers to hurl objects at them, but i dont think you can use a force push on them. Since it seems that th Vong are impervious to the force then it would not be able to grip them.

BrianDavion
1 February 2002, 12:26 PM
the immunity to the force about the Voing is one of the most annoying aspects of the Vong. I know they needed a new enemy but there where SO many aspects that they could have used.... mind you they did wanna go with dark Jedi originaly (wish GL hadn't nixed that idea:)

Exile
8 February 2002, 11:07 PM
In Star By Star a dark jedi uses some kind of force power to kill a vong. It was described as a purple net kinda thing, andyone know what that was?

Otonashi
11 February 2002, 02:30 PM
So far there are a few tricks that work on the Vong. Yes, that's right I called them the Vong. Using the force to better your situation will almost always work, rather than trying to use the force as a weapon against them. "Enhanced ability" and "Battlemind" work well in giving you a boost during combat. Using "Move Object" to place thermal detonators in creative places is always good. The Vong are mighty foes, you just have to work around thier force immunity. By the way, most of their engineered slave races can still by affected directrly by the force.

Corsair
11 February 2002, 11:00 PM
the immunity to the force about the Voing is one of the most annoying aspects of the Vong.

Actually, I would say the opposite. Its about time something came along that showed that the Jedi were not the best thing since sliced bread. I am actually glad to see the Jedi getting the whooped.

Anyway, other tactic you can use against the Vong ;) is to affect the area around them. Though they do not have a presence in the force and thus cannot be directly affected by it (things such as force push, grip will not work), the air around them and other living things can be.

One tactic which has been employed in one of the NJO books was to create a vacuum around a Vong Warrior and deplete it of air thus choking the Vong Warrior to death.

Other things such as lifting trees and stuff and hurling it at them also work.

Luke used an immense amount of his power (exhausted himself in fact) when he manipulated the gravity well type anomaly that is produced by the Vong thingies (i cant remember the name .. you know .. the ones which suck up laser bolts etc). What he did exactly I cant remember off the top of my head but it was in one of the first 3 books in the NJO series I think.

Also, you must remember, as the Vong cannot be sensed in the force, so the Jedi cannot pre-empt or sense the vong in the force. This allows the Vong to pull suprise attacks.

Although recently, the Jedi have been using their brains, and when they use the force to sorta "sweep" the are around them, if they pick up any blanks/black areas/nothingness in the force they know Vong are there. Just another tactic, athough I think the DC check for it would be quite high.

Otonashi
12 February 2002, 05:03 AM
There is another force ability that could be used against the Vong; Alchemy. Take the genetic engineering game to a horrible new high and start unleashing dark side monsters on the Vong and let them see how funny it is. You could go big and start creating Sith Dragons, or you could go small and work up an insect that injected metachlorians with each sting, slowly exposing the Vong to the force. Either way, once you open this gate it is very hard to close it. I guess it comes down to who and what you want to have around in the future. I have my own theories about the Sith creating the Vong as a specialized soldier to use against the Jedi, but I’ll keep them to myself for now.

Wade Trenor
13 February 2002, 04:40 PM
Originally posted by Otonashi
There is another force ability that could be used against the Vong; Alchemy. Take the genetic engineering game to a horrible new high and start unleashing dark side monsters on the Vong and let them see how funny it is.

I like the way you think. :D

Hey, Corsair..???

Anyway, I keep hearing things like pick up rocks using the Move Object skill and chuck them at the Vong ;) . How about a combination of Move Object and the Throw Lightsaber feat? Also, continuing from Corsair's idea, the use of Force Storms would aid in removing any local Vong threats.

Corsair
13 February 2002, 10:27 PM
Do also remember that the Yuuzhan Vong cannot be stunned .. well .. they can be knocked on the head and stunned of course .. but they cant be stunned using a stun setting on a blaster pistol or anything like that. Basically, anything that does stun damamge wont affect them. Which makes it that much harder to try and capture one of them alive .. which is giving me evil GM thoughts. :D

With the Move Object and Throw Lightsaber ... do you have to use them in combination? I cant look it up coz I dont have the book with me. But yes you could chuck ya lightsaber at them (this is done a few times during NJO i think) and control where you want the saber to go. Though I would think this would be a hard thing to do ... but it would depend on where your intended target was .. or if you are just doing some random hurling to clear a path etc etc.

Oh and Otonashi .. stop planting evil ideas into Trenor's head. He is evil enough as it is. ;) :p :D

P.S. I dont know about the validity of your ideas Otonashi .. but they do sound pretty good if plausable.

Otonashi
16 February 2002, 05:09 AM
I've found another way to stick it to the Vong. I have acquired wrist mounted razorblade projectors, an updated version of the Sith Lanvarok. Additionally, one of my fellow adventurers has acquired a blaster carbine with an under barrel spear gun attachment.
Basically the tactic works like this; Fire a projectile into the Vong warrior and use move object on the projectile once it is inside them. The DC changes because you are now moving the projectile + the Vong, but in a pinch it is a great way to throw those big jerks around. I suppose that if you concentrated on just moving the projectile, especially the razor blade style, you could make it travel around inside the Vonger. Let's see how much they embrace THAT pain.

Tramp
25 February 2002, 09:41 AM
The only problem with that idea is that you have to see the object you're moving about.

Otonashi
25 February 2002, 10:16 AM
True, you must be able to see the object in question, forgot about that part. All of my suggestions are ,of course, subject to review by individual GMs. I'm just putting my warped thoughts out there for others to ponder.

BrianDavion
25 February 2002, 10:17 AM
what about Illusion. would the Vong see through a force illusion?

Dark Knight
16 March 2002, 11:22 PM
Originally posted by Exile
In Star By Star a dark jedi uses some kind of force power to kill a vong. It was described as a purple net kinda thing, andyone know what that was?

The way it was described i thought that it was force lightning. And Tahiri uses the force to manipulate the air molecules the vong breathed in Edge of Victory 1so i have no idea what works and what doesnt work.

Terras Jadeonar & Raven
17 March 2002, 10:18 AM
I thought that skill was one of the ones that required the openent being effected by the force. since the vong are imune to the force in that sense... i doubt Force illusion would work ...

feel free to correct me if i'm wrong... :)

darth maim
18 March 2002, 11:11 PM
Originally posted by Corsair
One tactic which has been employed in one of the NJO books was to create a vacuum around a Vong Warrior and deplete it of air thus choking the Vong Warrior to death.

As a GM I'd honestly rule that this tactic would earn a DSP quickly... it's torture killing by suffocation. It's no different than forcegrip really (which slaps you with a DSP every time)

Oh and regarding the sith alchemy...

The idea of an insect that "infected" them with midichlorians (although I loathe a scientific explanation for the force) would be the easiest to live with once it started working. Most likely force users would get a boost when bitten. Here are the drawbacks though:

1) it would take a long time for them to actually get into the force enough.
2) There's no telling if this would actually work... it may be something entirely more sinister at work here.
3) if this actually gave someone a higher place in the force you'd start to have a huge outbreak of force users running around from all walks of life that are totally new to it. Could be very dangerous.
4) This would become a huge black market item... wanna be a Jedi kid?

Loche
19 March 2002, 09:57 PM
Hmm, Vong and the force. Just why aren't they in it? Lets look at 2 items. 1) The force is in everything, even the rocks, it is whay binds the GALAXY. 2) The Vong aren't from the Galaxy. This seems to be the rational behind the Vong Force immunity.

Bio lesson time, all the matter currently in your human body right now will be completely replaced wtih new matter in the next 7 years. Its a natural result of eating ;)

Since the Vong are now growing much of their food on worlds in the Galaxy with each bite they take a little bit more of it into thier being. Assuming Vong change over thier matter at a similar rate to humans in about 7 to 10 years the Vong should be comprised of material from the Galaxy not thier own.

Since the rocks are even part of the Force, the Vong's eating habits should eventually make them part of it to. No Midichlorians nessicary, rocks don't need em, Vong shouldn't either.

Since its been about 3 years since the invasion I'd expect to see some force sussepable Vong pretty soon, that is IF the NJO writers based their rational for the Vong force immunity on the same concepts I did, and they really thought it out logically.

Nom Anor is in for a nasty suprise soon! Muahahahaaa! :D

Krad-edis
19 March 2002, 11:38 PM
Here is one way to use the force that I can see being actively used against Vong Warriors by Jedi and other force users. It can be used to beat down and subdue or to finish the Vong off. The good thing about this way of doing things are that they are given in easy to follow steps that even Padawans can understand, and the Vong will have a very tough time dodging this type of attack.

The Force Bananna Peel- Look to see what the Vong are stepping on. Is it stable? Better yet....is it a carpet, a piece of equipment, a rock? Whatever it is, telekinetically whip that object out from under his feet. Kind of hard to dodge an attack without seeing it coming and without any footing. Now that the Vong is on the ground, use the object to keep him there. If it is heavy, drop it on his arms or legs. For a more permanent version of keeping him subdued, drop it on his twisted tatooed face!

DSP? There is no torturing there. Plainly the means of fighting a war against those who have an advantage of force immunity, and have superior numbers.

Jedi, Noghri, Republic Soliders, or anyone who ends up fighting the Vong should set traps if they can. Look at the damage the little Ewoks did against the Imperial War Machine. While the Noghri and Soldiers are limited to conventional means (i.e. remote control stuff, booby traps), a Jedi with the force can flip switches to automatically crush Vong in blast doors, tear loose pieces of flooring up in order to make Vong fall to their deaths (or at least knock them off balance and hopefully down). Loose items, such as barrels, rocks, carpeting :D , durasteel panels, equipment (i.e. 50 kg generators), and anything available which is remotely solid should be kept in consideration for future use.

The Jedi's imagination and creativeness with telekinetics is his or her biggest advantage against the Vong.

Four to one odds? Ooops! One Vong found out what a blast door warning sign says too late. Ooops! One Vong stepped on a metal grate, and forgot to pack his bioengineered wings. It is a long way down. Ooops! One Vong stepped on a rock while coming towards a Jedi. Now he lies on his back with the rock on his chest. Now it is one to one odds...........hmmmm, much better. Draw lightsaber….SNAP…HISS!

darth maim
20 March 2002, 12:51 AM
I was just thinking of ways that one could possibly snake out infiltrating vong. A jedi could place an illusion up that causes a certain reaction. (such as a pit, a wall, an armed assialant)... the Vong being immune to alter based force usage would not see this illusion and thus act as if there were no pit, wall, etc... this could at least tip you off that this guy needs a more thorough looking at.

Otonashi
7 April 2002, 12:01 PM
I suppose that See Force would also work against the Vong. It is more of a precautionary use, like using illusion to sort out the Vong from a crowd. When you encounter somebody, ping them with a See Force. If they are actually a Vong using a cloaker, they will not have an aura that you can sense. Then you can proceed directly to the beat down.

Otonashi
17 April 2002, 06:19 AM
Okay...What about Force Whirlwind and Force Lightening? I'm sure that the debris cloud option of Force Whirlwind would work, but what about the energy based option? Same goes for Lightening, I'm talking about a physical manifestaion of the force. Would that affect the Vong?

Darth Bile
17 April 2002, 03:11 PM
well, palpatine had the ultimate force power to use against the vong in the dark empire graphic novel, Create Force Storm. not much could survive that, including his flag ship, which was an eclipse class star destroyer with a death star laser on it, bout 10 times the size of super star destroyer and it was destroyed in less than a minute. Now, in my campaign, i have a sith lord who isn't afraid to use that power against anything or anyone would he thinks could threaten his control of the unknown regions, including the vong, heck, one of the players convinced the vong that the jedi had hidden out on the outskirts of the unknown region and when they sent a ship after it, it was destroyed with the jedi as witnesses to the power of the jedi, now unfortunately, the rest of the galaxy knows there is a power sith lord afoot in the galaxy.

Mathis Kharr
18 April 2002, 02:12 AM
Force lightning if it hasn't been mentioned and a few darkside powers seem to function nicly on the Vong so try them out lol

Otonashi
18 April 2002, 04:05 AM
So to recap the last 2 pages on the topic of what force powers work against the Vong;
Powers used to benefit the force user are
-Battle mind
-Enhanced Ability
-See Force (to detect the lack of the force in a cloaked Vonger)
-Illusion (to separate Vongers from a crowd)
-Rage
Powers that can be used directly against the Vong are:
-Move Object (ala “force banana-peel”, throwing stuff, & to create a vacuum )
-Throw Lightsaber
-Force Whirlwind
-Force Lightening
-Force Storm
-Force push (only if you jam something in them first, then use the power on the object)
Powers that will make the Vong’s life tough:
-Alchemy (create new monsters, or work to counter their biotechnology)
-Sorcery (dead Sith are just as nasty as the Vong and may have ideas)

Any other thoughts?

Tonda
19 April 2002, 09:35 AM
It has been saod many times in these post that the VONG are immune to direct methods of Force usage and that indirect methods must be advised.

I don't know what the dark Jedi used against that Vong in orbit around Mykr but it might be nice to know.

It has been seen many times in the books that using Animals against the vong is a GOOD idea. Slash rats worked good and so did those mutated Vornskr's. (name has escaped me) So a (I think it see force that allows you to sense animals and human) See force check can let you sense animals and then you use affect mind to call them to attack the Vong.

Tonda
19 April 2002, 09:44 AM
Force lightning would work on the vong. Charged electrons in the air are used to electrify the Vong. Same thing as sticking apower cable up their Butt. ZAP Bye Bye Vong.

Jovas Kig
15 July 2002, 01:51 PM
Hi there!

I am kind of new at this and have yet to read all the NJO books. The last one I have got to is Dark Journey.

I discuss the Vong and my understanding of them further down. I have been looking at the stats of the Voxyn and am confused (as elsewhere in the NJO source book) by the inconsistencies between what's mentioned in the sourcebook and what I have read the Jedi doing in the various novels.

The Voxyn, if I remember right, first make their appearance in Star by Star. They are capable of hunting Force users through the Force and are very hard to kill. Many Jedi are slaughtered by them and the mission involves a Jedi commando raid on the Vong worldship to destroy the Voxyn queen and remove the threat (or at least try to level the field).

According to the stats in the NJO, these fierce creatures have both Force Powers and are Force Immune. That in itself sounds like a glaring contradiction. It reminds me of how a player had mentioned he wanted to play a Vong Dark Jedi.:p

But that is not what really bothers me.
What is "conveniently" ignored in the NJO source book is the fact that in the process of defeating the Voxyn queen, Jacen used Affect Mind to trick the creature to kill the Vong tenders that were trying to protect her. 8o

This was very draining for him and because of it he was not able to flee with the other surviving Jedi.

In there lies the problem... How do you use affect mind on a Force Immune creature?
:?

From what I have seen so far Vong can be tossed around with either Force push or whirlwind. However if a Jedi uses such an attack it seems to drain their reserve pretty quickly.
Notice how Anakin did comparatively better versus Kyp Durron in the battle on Ithor. Anakin was conserving his Force reserves and tapping his mental and physical abilities while other Jedi kept using the Force to throw the Vong around.

I was considering (if my players ever want to do a NJO campaign) that I would make using Force powers (against Vong) either impossible or very expensive (more vitality points) depending on the situation or the particular power.

For example direct use of something like Force Push would cost double (or quadruple) the normal VP cost. If the Jedi instead did the "Banana Peel" attack, she could conserve her vitality points. This would be a way to encourage Jedi players to innovate when fighting the Vong. It also shows how much more important non-Jedi allies are in aiding the Jedi against the Vong.

It seems that the Dark side witch used a new and as of yet undescribed dark side power. Force lightning tends to fry the target. She sliced and diced.

Thanks for reading my post.

Sincerely,

Jovas Kig
:D

powalsh
1 August 2002, 06:16 AM
"SPOILERS!!!"














"Spoilers!!!!"













"SPOILERS!!!"













Okay, if you are still reading this and you havent read Traitor then stop it. If you have read traitor then by all means proceed. In the most recent instalment on th NJO series we see Jacen use Force Lightning on the Vong. However it does not affect them in any way. It burns the crud out of Vergere and scorches Jacen's hand but the Vong are fine. So I think we can chalk Force Lightning in the Doesnt work on Vong column. However the book also shows that the Force is life and that all living things are the force. So the force does affect the vong, just not the force we know and love. Instead it is a new brach of the force that must be learned, to quote Rodney Dangerfield " The Hard Way". So in the future I believe we are going to have to change our list around.