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View Full Version : Coruscant and Corellia- the same planet?



Reverend Strone
26 March 2002, 12:02 PM
Okay, here's a thought-

In the movies so far, we've had references to things of Corellian origin, and we've had references to the planet Coruscant.

Can anyone ever recall any reference in the movies to a planet called Corellia, or remember anyone from Coruscant being refered to as a Coruscantian or something similar?

The reason I ask is I have a theory that at some point in the next two movies Mr Lucas is going to pull a fast one and throw in a quip somewhere which suggests that Corellians are actually from Coruscant, effectively nuking the EU.

It's just speculation of course, but I just wonder if in his mind, they're the same place. Think about it- it would make sense if the 'Big Corellian Ships' actually came from the Imperial homeworld wouldn't it?

Lucas has already demonstrated a certain disregard for EU material- and to a degree, I have no issue with that (it's his Universe after all), but this one would be a real doosey, even for The Flannelled One.

Just a theory, and I hope I'm wrong. Can anyone find evidence either way?

darth maim
26 March 2002, 03:27 PM
it may not be from the movies but lucas has to ok the info put out for the gaming stuff and just look at the maps... Coruscant over here.... Corellia over there.

Dark Knight
26 March 2002, 03:27 PM
ok.......my first qusetion is WHATT!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Look at a frickin map of the galaxy....any one will do....seriously

and maybe it's all eu but wouldn't you think that between han being from corellia and the whole big lets go to coruscant pilgramage from ep1 that maybe just maybe 1 would be able to tell the difference.

Reverend Strone
26 March 2002, 04:49 PM
No no please guys- I agree with you, but lets be honest, what is the origin of the planet Corellia thing? It only exists because we infer it to do so from the comments that Han makes about the Star Destroyers. It's not beyond reasonable doubt that someone from Coruscant could be called a Corellian is it?

Lucas has never mentioned it, nor do I remember ever hearing a word for someone from Coruscant- hence it made me wonder if we and the Eu community in general, in our rush to extrapolate and expand the SW Universe, might have gotten it a little different to Lucas' original notion.

As far as maps go, they're all generated by licensees, not by Lucasfilms. I've lost count of how many different ones I've seen.

An example of what I mean is the Mandalorian background for Boba Fett. It's a story that has grown through the licenses and EU material which Lucasfilms authenticate with their stamp of approval, but I'll eat my hat if we ever hear the word Mandalorian in Episode Two.

It's just speculation on my part, but really, what proof do we have for any of this stuff that we accept as SW Universe canon, when Lucas himself probably never thought about it, or if he has, hasn't revealed his true plans for it yet?

As I said, I sure hope I'm wrong, because it would be darned inconvenient in the least, but who's to say this isn't the case?

Talonne Hauk
26 March 2002, 07:46 PM
Well, obviously, we can't be sure at this point, since we still have two movies to see. But Coruscant, as a name, was invented by Timothy Zahn. Originally, the planet as it came from Lucas was called Imperial Center. Lucas had originally planned on showing a few scenes on Imperial Center, and artwork was commisioned for that, and it was all labeled Imperial Center cityscapes. I think if it was originally Corellia, it would have either been labeled as such or hyphenated. And, although Brian Daley's Han Solo trilogy is EU, it was written around the time the original trilogy was being produced. That makes it, in my mind, more authoritative than the stuff produced in the last decade. (Some of which was pure drek.) And Brian Daley made a few references to Corellia in the present tense of the book's storyline. So that leads me to believe that they're two separate systems. Besides, why would Lucas intentionally throw a monkeywrench into his product like that? Then it would be Star Trek!:D

Reverend Strone
26 March 2002, 08:04 PM
Okay, this new info makes me feel so much better. I wasn't aware that Coruscant came from Zahn's books. If Lucas adopted that name into his accepted canon, even going so far as to use the name henceforth in his movies, that bodes very well. Actually it pretty much throws out any concerns I had, and any reason for this thread.

I always assumed (what is it they say about that word?) that the name Coruscant originated from Lucas himself. That's why I thought there was a link. This throws a whole different light on it in my mind.

Thanks for putting my mind at ease Talonne Hauk . My apologies if I threw folk into a spin with my blind musings.

Hmmm, I'll have to find something else to cultivate brow wrinkles about now.

darth maim
26 March 2002, 09:03 PM
There was no Coruscant until the SE trilogy came out. Timothy Zahn actually named it if I recall correctly. Therefore an off handed remark by Han couldn't have been in refference to Coruscant as there was no such place at the time of said comment. Proof Positive.

darth maim
26 March 2002, 09:07 PM
I REALLY need to read further down before postin dammit!! I just noticed that Talonne Hauk said the same damn thing....

Mathis Kharr
26 March 2002, 11:38 PM
Corellia and coruscant the same planet? I don't think so. as was said above lucas has to ok every shred of stuff about starwars, without his ok nothing gets published and in my oppinion it would behoove him to allow it to exist because it would simply create another option for him to add to any one of his not completed movies. besides i like corellia better then coruscant anyhow.

Reverend Strone
27 March 2002, 11:52 AM
What is it they say about great minds Darth ?

sebulba524
27 March 2002, 01:56 PM
I thought Lucas came up with Coruscant. It was in one of the earlier drafts. Zahn just used it.

Tramp
28 March 2002, 11:08 AM
Originally posted by sebulba524
I thought Lucas came up with Coruscant. It was in one of the earlier drafts. Zahn just used it.

No, Zahn came up with it. George Lucas said as much in an article I read ( I can't remember the exact article though).

Jedi Master Antilles
28 March 2002, 01:37 PM
corellia and coruscant the same? nah...theyre not...i'm sure episode 2 will provide more proof for you once it's released.

Dr_Worm
28 March 2002, 02:02 PM
As has been said before they are not the same planet. However I think it would be damn funny if Lucas did that. I would jus pee my pants laughing. I have liked a few of the novels, but it sometimes makes me groan when people argue about cannnon and all that. If Lucas put the smackdown on the EU...oh man.

KJA: Mr Lucas you can't just say they are the same planet, we have written novel after novel that says they aren't

Lucas: Oh yea Kev? Well I'll show you who the true Jedi Master is! You've heard of the power of the force, now feel the force of my copywrite!(laughs maniacally like a mad scientist)

I mean no offense to anyone, except KJA, but I really find these power struggles range from ammusing to sad.

DirkGreystoke
28 March 2002, 03:40 PM
This is a very interesting topic, but first one thing needs to be clear. George Lucas does not OK novel of RPG supplements, that is someone elses job at Lucasfilm. So although it is highly improbable, based on what we know only from the films Corellia and Coruscant could be the same place. But as I said before I highly doubt it. After all, in the first three drafts of the EPIV script Alderaan was the homeworld of the Empire, so anything can happen. If one wants to go strictly by cannon, then all the maps we have seen thus far are null and void, since Lucas does not look them over before they go into a book or magazine {such as the more recent one in Star Wars Gamer.}

Although I do tend to agree with Talonne on the Brain Daley issue. Personally, I have a hunch we will see a Corellian senator in Attack of the Clones. This is not a spoiler, just a hunch I have.

Reverend Strone
28 March 2002, 03:51 PM
Dirk , you've understood exactly where I was coming from with this thread. I do agree however, it is unlikely (thank goodness) and based on what I've learned from the posts here, it seems fairly certain Lucas has adopted Courscant as the name for the Imp Homeworld as distnct from the Corellian homeworld, so my fears are much allayed.

DirkGreystoke
28 March 2002, 09:03 PM
Quite true, but George has suprised us before. Who in 1980 expected Vader to be Luke's father?

BrianDavion
29 March 2002, 06:25 AM
I did! ok ok ignoreing the fact that I'm 19 and thus wasn't even ALIVE in '80 much less a SW fan at the time :)

Nova Spice
30 March 2002, 09:29 PM
Lucas isn't going to pull a fast one here, due to the fact of a recent article read on www.theforce.net concerning canon and non-canon. This guy made a great point about Lucas RELYING on the EU...run on over there and check out the article in their Miscellaneous section..it might be in the Archives since it was there last week....Besides, Coruscant and Corellia both appear as different planets in the NJO book maps so that is enough to toss this speculation down the drain IMHO. However, it is a very good speculation for this forum, but it is only a speculation and am 99.99999999999 % sure it will never come true.

Rouge8
31 March 2002, 11:20 AM
I'm positive it won't come true. Honestly, would Lucas approve of something and then throw it down the drain (that something being the EU).

DirkGreystoke
2 April 2002, 10:51 PM
POSSIBLE SPOILERS!


I'm positive it won't come true. Honestly, would Lucas approve of something and then throw it down the drain (that something being the EU).

Yes. First of all, not to get off topic, but Lucas does not approve the EU, Steve Sansweet and his staff at Lucasfilm do on George Lucas' behalf. Therefore Lucas has no obligation to follow the EU.

Also, Nova Lucas in no way relies on the EU...in fact it is the opposite. Episode II has wiped out to major EU plotlines.

1 - Tales of the Jedi storyline no longer exists. In the new EPII trailer, Sio Bibble says and I quote, "There has not been a full scale war since the formation of the Republic." In TOTJ the Repulic is involved in several wars with the Sith and other opponents. According to cannon they never happened.

2- In the NJO Luke marries Mara Jade. In EPII we see that "Jedi are not allowed to love," as has been seen in mulitple trailers. I do not fault the EU authors, since Lucas had not revealed this until last year....but it still does not compute. You can say that Luke wouldn't know that, but I don't buy that. If Jedi not "loving" was common knowledge, then surely an old timer like Mon Mothma of General Nadine could have filled him in.

Sorry to get off topic, but I realy hate it when people try to say that Lucas is somehow involved in the EU creation process..because nothing could be further from the truth. The fact the Coruscant was written in to The Phantom Menace script is the only exception, and certainly not the rule. It for this reason that Lucas could reveal that Corellia and Coruscant are in fact the same place. I would agree with most of you that it is highly unlikely, but still remotely possible...based on what we have seen in the films.

Frobi-Wan Kenobi
2 April 2002, 11:55 PM
Like it was said earlier: Lucas is using parts of the EU. The name of Coruscant is one of the best examples.

As for the "their hasn't been a full scale war" part. That has been discussed in numerous other threads. The conclusion that they came to was that full scale is the operative term. Minor battles out on the rim where the Jedi are involved doesn't constitute a war. That is like saying the US was fighting a war in the late '40s in Greece (officers that were the precursors to the Special Forces were there "advising"). Bibble was on Naboo during that battle, he saw it first hand, and he knows that that was not a full scale war. Full Scale wars are when ever single person in the countries involved lifes are affected daily, like WW2.

As far as the Jedi cannot love thing. It wouldn't be the Will of the Force for the Jedi not to love. I would have to say that was just a rule that the Jedi Council made up before the Purge. Luke doesn't take kids from their parents. Why shouldn't he get to have a little action?

I sincerely doubt that Lucas would make coruscant and corellia the same system for this reason: we have seen corellia far to many times for him to make it not be the corellia we know and love. Even if he doesn't care about EU (which I hope is not the case) his staff who are at least some of them fans would call him on it.

darth maim
3 April 2002, 01:35 AM
Originally posted by DirkGreystoke
POSSIBLE SPOILERS!

1 - Tales of the Jedi storyline no longer exists. In the new EPII trailer, Sio Bibble says and I quote, "There has not been a full scale war since the formation of the Republic." In TOTJ the Repulic is involved in several wars with the Sith and other opponents. According to cannon they never happened.

2- In the NJO Luke marries Mara Jade. In EPII we see that "Jedi are not allowed to love," as has been seen in mulitple trailers. I do not fault the EU authors, since Lucas had not revealed this until last year....but it still does not compute. You can say that Luke wouldn't know that, but I don't buy that. If Jedi not "loving" was common knowledge, then surely an old timer like Mon Mothma of General Nadine could have filled him in.


Wow you must have somehow allready seen episode II... was it good?

Seriously though. We have like a total of maybe 5 minutes of footage randomly pulled from a 2 hour movie to go by... making final conclusions as to canon rules on this is silly.

Tramp
4 April 2002, 01:16 PM
Nova Spice, what is the name of that artcle on theForce.net? I can't seem to find it.

Jastor
10 April 2002, 12:10 PM
Corellians on Corelllia

Good Imperial Citizens on Coruscant ;)

long live the empire and the new order

reliant
11 April 2002, 11:26 AM
On starwars.com they have entries for Coruscant but not for Corellia. However, Corellia is mentioned in several of the character profiles found there, and is definately NOT the "Imperial Center" or Coruscant as we know it. Also, the Millenium Falcon was a Corellian YT-1300 long before there even was a Coruscant (if Zahn made up the name), therefore they can't be the same place.

It is an interesting theory though...

Now someone mentioned Luke and Mara getting married, and how in EP II the jedi are not supposed to fall in love (it's in the jedi code isn't it?). BUT, in almost all the NJO books, jedi are falling in love all over the place. The explanation? The jedi of the NJO are not even close to the jedi of the old republic. Hence them being called the New Jedi Order. Seems to me Luke just tossed out the codes he didn't like and just used what he wanted. No wonder he lost so many students to the dark side... :raised:

Just my two creds worth...

Dan Kyrinov
18 April 2002, 07:51 PM
On the issue of Luke and Mara falling in love, look up the archives for the Jedi Council at starwars.com under the member of the answer panel "Jocasta Nu" and find the topic "If Jedi aren't allowed to fall in love, then how do you explain Luke and Mara?" It should prove that the officials, if not Lucas himself, are determined to reconcile those points.

Tramp
19 April 2002, 07:45 AM
Originally posted by Dan Kyrinov
On the issue of Luke and Mara falling in love, look up the archives for the Jedi Council at starwars.com under the member of the answer panel "Jocasta Nu" and find the topic "If Jedi aren't allowed to fall in love, then how do you explain Luke and Mara?" It should prove that the officials, if not Lucas himself, are determined to reconcile those points.

Not only that. If you read Star Wars Union, Luke stated that he didn't even know IF jedi could marry during the time of the Old Republic. When Corran mentions that his grandfather was married to his grandmother and he was a Jedi, luke says " yes, but he was Correlian."

Jett Darkstar
19 April 2002, 10:58 AM
Good points, people. I have to disagree with Dirk Greystoke about TotJ being contradicted. :raised:

I've read the DH comic series "Tales of the Jedi" (and own most of the TPBs of said series) and nowhere do the writers imply that either The Hyperspace War or the Sith War were full-fledged wars.

My points are shown here: In "Fall of the Sith Empire", except for the Jedi Order, the Republic did little if any fighting; the forces of Empress Teta with the assistance of the Order of Jedi Knights did almost all the fighting against the Sith forces both in space and planetside. Her army and navy had just liberated the Koros system and though she had recently joined the Republic, her forces do not qualify as "Republic forces". Rather, they are the Koros defense forces. So, the Fall of the Sith Empire is not contradicted yet by any speculations about Episode II. :rolleyes:

The Sith War: Again, this conflict was fought mostly by the Jedi Order. Most of this conflict involved a handful of strikes by Ulic Qel-Droma at Coruscant and by Exar Kun at Ossus. Most if not all of the forces involved in the counterstrikes were by the Jedi Order, not the Republic forces. Therefore, no contradiction yet. :rolleyes:

And considering how quickly these two conflicts were resolved, they would hardly qualify as "full-scale wars". So IMHO, the TotJ Era stands as EU, not Infinity. It's not discounted nor is it hard fact.

As far as all the wild speculation on Episode II and III stand, I'll wait until I see the movies and then draw my own conclusions. Not one microsecond before.

C'mon, guys and girls, I left the WotC boards to get away from EU vs. Canon arguments. Can't we all just get along?? :(

Rouge8
19 April 2002, 04:57 PM
If lucas says they are, well then there wil be dead bodies at Lucasfilm. So what if I'm a subtle one of the Emporer's Hands?

CrazyDubya
26 April 2002, 01:02 AM
If anyoen reads the baords at StarWars galaxies you may know that the devlopers of the game make very clear that Lucas himself is invovled in the process.

Most things go through Lucas Licensing First, but if they can't answer it or it is a MAJOR thing, it goes to George Lucas himself. (Ex. EU killing of Chewie -Which majorly Sucked)

The EU may have some continuity issues, but I severly doubt Lucas would ever do something like that since, he is invovled in ok'ing certain aspects of the major storylines and Luca Liscening is the one who decided after Timothy Zahn's first novel that the Star War's EU would have continity throughout..every writer would follow the established storylines as the Uncverse grows

DirkGreystoke
28 April 2002, 02:22 PM
This is completely untrue. George reserves the right to do whatever he chooses with his universe, and he delegates the criterion of fitting into his universe to others...Not himself. Mr. Lucas is too busy making movies to keep track of every piece of the EU. Lucas did not OK the death of Chewbacca.....this was the doings of the senoir editors at Lucasfilm. In fact the extent of George's input to the entire New Jedi Order series was one word, "No!" It was an answer to the question.."Can we use Sith as bad guys?"

Talonne Hauk
28 April 2002, 06:13 PM
Sorry Dirk, but you're not 100% correct, either. Lucas provided a list of characters that were protected. Luke Skywalker supposedly heads that list. Chewbacca wasn't on it. It was decided that the death of Chewbacca would be the most meaningful and give the readers pause to think that this wasn't the same happy go lucky universe anymore, and the old plot twists and twinks weren't going to be happening.

Deathstalker
22 May 2002, 05:32 AM
First, one can't repeat it often enough, or so it seems: It is called CANON, people! A cannon is a large weapon, usually mounted on wheels, but CANON is the word you're looking for.

Second, the whole discussion is somewhere between annoying and amusing. I must admit that I don't understand people like Dirk Greystoke, who obviously like to gloat when pieces of the EU get trashed by Mr. Lucas. Granted, most EU material isn't Shakespeare, but neither are the movies themselves! I would vastly prefer any attempts to create a coherent universe unifying all the movies, books, comics and RPG products in one truly epic storyline than this whole "My movie is better than your novel"-schtick. Well, silly me...

Third, it's still incredibly easy to "fix" the contradicting passages mentioned by earlier posters. Here we go (spoilers ahead!):

"There has not been a full scale war since the formation of the Republic."
Big deal! Either you use the explaination that neither the Great Hyperspace War, nor the Sith War count as full scale wars, or you just look who's talking: Sio Bibble is a politician from a backwater planet, not an expert in ancient history. Remember, the TotJ storyline takes place 4,000 to 5,000 years in the past, so maybe the details of the conflict are no longer common knowledge in the galaxy? Or maybe many documents where lost during the devastation of Ossus? Maybe the Jedi Order is hiding the facts because it's rather embarassing to admit that two of their most promising students (Exar Kun and Ulic Quel-Droma) fell to the Dark Side? I mean, it certainly sets a bad example for the current generation of Jedi padawans and probably frightens the public.

"Jedi are not allowed to love."
So what? Either no one told Luke about the tenets of the old order, or he learned from past mistakes and simply ignores this rule. Part of Anakin's descent into darkness seems to come from the fact that he and Amidala need to keep their relationship a secret. Besides, the New Jedi Order desperately needs more Force-sensitive students, so it's a question of survival for them to encourage marriages of their members.

The Death Star plans and the Maw Installation
This was already answered elsewhere, but I'll include it here for the sake of the argument. We don't learn if the DS plans are already finished or not, so you can just assume they still need some work and are therefore sent to the Maw Installation for "polishing". Problem solved!

The making of Boba Fett
Now you got me! Both stories about his origins totally contradict each other and I see no way to bring them together. I suggest to use the story from AOTC as truth and the much weaker theory from TotBH as rumors or misinformation spread by Fett to cloud his origins as a clone.

When I prepare an adventure for the RPG, I'll always use the version of a story that opens up more possiblities for further drama and excitement. Therefore, TotJ happened in my campaign and the Maw Installation is out there as well. Sometimes, pieces of contradicting information can be excellent hooks for new plots, e. g. why did the Jedi Order hide key facts about the Sith War? Disregarding the EU severly limits the scope of the Star Wars universe, especially with regard to the RPG!

Thanks for reading, Deathstalker out!

VixenofVenus
22 May 2002, 08:07 AM
Originally posted by Deathstalker
The making of Boba Fett
Now you got me! Both stories about his origins totally contradict each other and I see no way to bring them together. I suggest to use the story from AOTC as truth and the much weaker theory from TotBH as rumors or misinformation spread by Fett to cloud his origins as a clone.


I agree with this ... I doubt Boba would want people to know that he was one of the very first clones the Kaminoans made in the batches of Clonetroopers ...

Superdog
22 May 2002, 01:56 PM
Originally posted by VixenofVenus


I agree with this ... I doubt Boba would want people to know that he was one of the very first clones the Kaminoans made in the batches of Clonetroopers ...

This is gonna sound wierd, but what if there are more than one Boba Fett. Boba goes back to some other clones and says: "Lo! The Jedi have killed our father! Our creator, the basis for or being! Vengenace must be sought!" They all don armor like Jango (Mandalorian in other words) and head out for some killing of good guys.

reliant
23 May 2002, 04:57 AM
I like the idea Superdog... I don't know if that would work though because all the other clones are altered to be super-obidient and just follow blindly. Now if Boba could make them all be loyal to him then that would be a different story...

Aldaron
6 June 2002, 06:20 AM
I can't confirm it 100% because I don't have access to my copy at the moment, but I'm positive I remember a line in the original <i>Star Wars</i> novelisation that explicitly states Han's heritage: when they are fleeing thru the Death Star's corridors, Chewie apparently growls at him something about knowing where they are going, and Han responds with..."Of course I know where I'm going. Corellians can't get lost!" To which Chewie responds with an argument against Han's statement, to which Han says: "(something or other) doesn't count, he wasn't a Corellian. Besides, I was drunk."

Now I know GL didn't actually <i>write</i> the novelisation (I <i>strongly</i> suspect it was Alan Dean Foster, as he wrote <i>Splinter of the Mind's Eye</i> straight after, and I'm sure I recognise his style in the SW novelisation), but it's gotta be <i>pretty</i> close to George-Lucas-Gospel.

Gray Area
9 June 2002, 01:20 PM
Let's be honest here, the folk writing EU works are passionate about the Star Wars Universe, thay are concerned with the consistancy and entire setting of the world we love. George on the other hands is a film maker, and as we see from the last two films not that good at it. He has destroyed so much of the majesty, mystery and power of the original series I find it hard to take any information in the new films as canon. To change the fantasic universe I in my head because of the bad discisions made by one man is ludicious. Hold on to the greatness from before, the force is not measured by a machine!!

reliant
10 June 2002, 05:01 AM
I don't understand all the people who bash the EU. Just because Mr. Lucas didn't write the stuff doesn't make it any less "star wars" than the movies. And with the crap movies that have been coming out lately I would actually say that good ol' GL could use some pointers from some of the EU writers!

As for the canon/non-canon debate, I think it is just stupid. It is a stupid debate every time it gets brought up and yet everyone loves to get to kick that particular dead horse over and over again. Who cares if it is canon or not? What difference does it really make?

I'm not trying to attack/offend anyone here, or be overly argumentative, this issue just really bugs me.

Gray Area
10 June 2002, 05:28 PM
I hear you Reliant, you repaet my thoughts on this matter entirely, good'ol george has not lifted his writting wit the star wars universe above that written by other folk. EU is save and sound as long as people recognise this fact.

Tramp
11 June 2002, 07:43 AM
Amen to that.