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View Full Version : The death of Mace Windu (Possible Spoilers)



madpoet
5 June 2002, 05:37 AM
For everyone that has seen the movie or read the book, or, if you're like me, both. Here's a fun little question.... How do you think Mace Windu will die?

We know he doesn't survive the Purge, so something must have happened. The theory I like is that young Boba Fett will return to do what his father couldn't do and whoop a little Windu butt.

What do you think?

Nova Spice
5 June 2002, 07:04 AM
I also tend to think little Boba may pop a cap in Windu's face and I agee with ya madpoet that this may be irony at its best ;) Although it is possible that perhaps Windu kills Dooku, and let's speculate that Dooku is the one that turns Anakin...perhaps Anakin strikes down Mace in rage, leaving only Yoda and Obi-Wan. And then his duel begins with Obi-Wan.

Although while we're on what happens to Mace, anyone have an idea what might become of Plo Koon and Ki-Adi Mundi? I didn't see them in the Council Chamber after the Battle of Geonosis....did they make it?

Nazgul
5 June 2002, 09:04 AM
I think Palpatine is going to take him out. Just me, but I don't think it'd be right if anyone less than the ultimate evil does it. He has to go down fighting, :)

VixenofVenus
5 June 2002, 08:52 PM
Originally posted by Nova Spice
Although while we're on what happens to Mace, anyone have an idea what might become of Plo Koon and Ki-Adi Mundi? I didn't see them in the Council Chamber after the Battle of Geonosis....did they make it?

I heard from a friend at Del Ray Publishing that they are working on publishing a book that will be coming out about a year and a half from now. It is about some of the 'Clone Wars' battles and stuff in-between Ep2 and Ep3. He told me that he had heard that in the current drafts (which have NOT been seen by Lucas or anyone at LucasBooks, but were contracted books) both Plo Koon and Ki-Adi Mundi were alive at the time at the end of Ep2, but were out fighting and leading those huge groups of Clonetroopers you see taking off in 'pre'-Star Destroyer ships.

Also, he told me that the reason the Council is so empty is because they decided to disband the Council and leave Yoda and Mace in full leadership until the Clone Wars were over and the Seperatists defeated. They need the Jedi Masters to be soldiers now. (Remember this is still not completely verified, just what he heard and read in the early draft)



Anyway ... thats what my friend told me. He usually gives me good info about upcoming books and he told me alot about the Ep2 book about a month before the book was released. Course, most of it was just a confirmation for a spoiler-junkie like me. :)

allstar6767
5 June 2002, 09:57 PM
Here's what my friends and I can peice together from rumors and fact...

Yoda Kills Dooku on Dagobah and his energies manifest in the tree

Obi Wans shoves anakin into the volcano(common knowledge)

During the end of the purge mace windu sacrifices himself to save yoda and obi wan by grabbing a sith and forcing both into a power reactor...

Plo Koon and Ki Adi make it and become generals

Adi galla dies at geonosis

Yaddle is missing from what we can see(maybe she's alive maybe she's not)

Depa Bilapa is killed by vader or another emporers hand, which aggrivates mace windu(her former master)

those are the only parts we can figure out, we also suspect anakin duels dooku one more time and looses but escapes. Anything else, personally i think there is no way in h*ll boba would stand a chance against mace, I mean look what he did to jango, there was barely a fight, and they are genetically identical

Krad-edis
5 June 2002, 11:57 PM
We saw "Boba the Kid" use starship weaponry on character scale Obi-wan in Episode II.....I would like to see Mace Windu try and deflect a carpet bombing strafe from the Slave I in Episode III. Sorry, but it doesn't really matter how good you are, you better get the hell out of the way of incoming concussion missiles and blaster cannon fire (the big version, or overkill version of busting a cap in someone's face). No lightsaber is going to help you against that. BA-BOOM! Mace looses! It seems to be Boba Fett's style early on to take out the enemy. Hey, whatever works. Kind of a cheap way to go out, but it really seems to be the only option against someone like Mace. I want to rule out my thoughts on Anakin as Anakin or Anakin as Vader killing Windu. I still think that Mace would chop suey Vader in a few seconds. Again, my belief is that Mace will go out in a bang....a very large one.

I wouldn't put it past Vader to "murder and betray" the Jedi. In other words, the ones he couldn't beat, he blew up (Boba Fett) or ambushed (Stormtroopers). Vader seems to have Stormies all around him. Maybe it has always been that way.

I think that the Yoda versus Dooku on Degobah is pretty close to the mark. Dooku seemed to be able to hold his own even against Yoda. I don't know for sure, but it would seem to me that Dooku would cut Windu to ribbons. I think Yoda is the only one who can do the job. It would be cool to see those two continue their duel.

I don't know what will happen to the rest of the Jedi. My guess is that Plo Koon, Adi Gallia (if not already, RIP), Ki Adi Mundi, Yaddle, Kit Fisto and the rest of the gang get totalled in Episode III. It would be cool not to see it on screen, so that for role-playing purposes, I can have a Jedi Purge era game where one of the surviving Council members actually lives (besides Yoda), and can teach. Wishful thinking. I'm pretty (guessing) sure we will get to see them kick the bucket. Lucas wasn't too shy about showing us dead Jedi in Episode II, we know too well that more are sure to follow.

I'm not so sure how Anakin turns fully. I will just have to wait. I am guessing that Anakin is told that Amidala is dead by Chancellor Palpatine, and that it WAS OBI-WAN's fault. Obi-wan goes in search of finding a distressed Anakin, and finds a very P.O'd Anakin. Then the fun begins ending with Anakin medium rare, only to be found by Palpatine who gives him extensive cyborging and fuels his rage with :

"Look what the Jedi have done to you. They prevented you from saving your mother, were responisible for the death of your wife, and tried to kill you. Work for me. We will destroy those criminals together."

"Yes, my Master."

Anyhow......if Episode III is as fast and action packed as Episode II........it is going to be cool no matter what. I can't wait to see it.

allstar6767
6 June 2002, 07:00 AM
LMAO, Dooku beat windu, lol, thats hilarious, windu is considered the best swordsman and rivals yoda as far as force pontential, that is why he is the head of the jedi council(not yoda, which many people formulated somehow), I do agree with you that if boba used concussion missles or something other than an energy weapon with that much force mace would have a hard time avoiding it, but I deffinantly wouldn't put it past him... as far as the ani thing is concerned i personally think that palapatine gets to him(as you said), but I think that he is much more subtle than 'Look what those Jedi did' I also think palpy pitted ani V obi but over estimated anakins ability, and obi didn't have the heart to kill him, so if shoved him in the volcano where he figured ani would make it out but couldn't be a threat, also if you noticed anakin loses his saber at least one more time to obi... As far as Adi Galla I am pretty sure she dies, same with fisto, but I am not so sure about yaddle, it wouldn't suprise me if she was still living right up to or even during the rebellion era, she was only 500, compared to yoda's 900(hey that gives me an idea for a NPC jedi...) BTW what is yoda and yaddles species?

Krad-edis
6 June 2002, 01:53 PM
Where does it say that Windu is the head of the Jedi Council and that he rivals Yoda on force potential?


"No one has a midichlorian count that high, not even Master Yoda."

If anyone rivals Yoda, or beats Yoda, it is Anakin or possibly Sidious, though I seriously doubt the latter.

I think the guy in charge is the one with almost a thousand years more experience than the rest.....Yoda. Yoda was making descisions for the Council probably before Windu was even discovered as a force sensitive. Yoda would kick the crap out of Windu.....no contest in my opinion. And since Dooku held his own against Yoda, I think Dooku has a pretty good chance of beating Windu, and with what I saw of his abilities (Windu) in Episode II, I wasn't that impressed (that is, next to Yoda).

It is funny that you took that as a joke, allstar6767, afterall it is speculation, and I did use "I believe", or "in my opinion" or "I think"....or words to that affect to speculate. However, I wouldn't post speculation here unless the facts added up. Now is this idea of "Windu is in charge" a fact or your speculation? I would tend to think that many would disagree with what you say there. If it is a fact, could you post the source?

allstar6767
6 June 2002, 10:34 PM
"He is as wise as Master Yoda, and as powerful as Master WIndu" - Anakin, Episode II, as far as actually remembering where I saw that Mace Windu was the head of the jedi council I am not sure, but I know it is canon and I will find it... lol, just wanted to make sure that you are takin' this as a discussion and not and arguement too.

BrianDavion
7 June 2002, 12:52 AM
yoda and mace windu are joint heads

Krad-edis
7 June 2002, 12:59 AM
No need for arguments or getting angry, and I am sorry if I appeared to be jumping down your throat allstar6767 , I am just really curious to see where you saw it (the leadership of Mace decleration). I watched Episode I again recently and it seemed as if Yoda and Mace kind of shared the responsibility of leadership. My guess is that Yoda is the main advisor on all matters and Windu is kind of like the foreman. Almost as if Yoda is preparing Windu to take over in years ahead.

My case in point with the lightsaber dueling is easier explained with the D6 system if you are familiar with it, allstar6767, you may see what I am getting at.

Suppose you have a Knight who is a warrior (Guardian) and a Master who is a more diplomatic Jedi (Consular). The younger Knight has a lightsaber skill of 8D, while the diplomatic Master has a lightsaber skill of 6D. What about the Control and Sense skills? Lets suppose that the Knight has 7D in Control and 6D+2 in Sense. Let us also suppose that the Master has 12D in Control and 11D+2 in Sense.

Lightsaber Combat comes into play:

Knight 7D (-1D) and 6D+2 (-1D) come to 6D and 5D+2. Add the 8D to 5D+2 which comes out to 13D+2 to the Knight's lightsaber skill without further actions.

Master 12D (-1D) and 11D+2 (-1D) come to 11D and 10D+2. Add the 6D to 10D+2 which comes out to 16D+2 to the Master's lightsaber skill without further actions.

Do you see my point? A young fiery brash warrior knight may meet his end very quickly against a rather nerdy diplomatic Master. Mace Windu may have incredible technique with the lightsaber. Yoda doesn't need it. Dooku doesn't need it either, IMHO. Both probably outclass Windu in understanding the force (Yoda does by default). While Windu was practicing saber techniques, Yoda and Dooku (who are both his senior in age and probably study) are learning Control and Sense. You don't have to be a Blade Master in order to beat one, if the force is your ally. . In my opinion, Yoda doesn't have stats. How can you put 900 years of force study to a dice code? You really can't, and if I did, I would put Yoda right around 15D to 20D at least in force skills! It is only fair if Vader in a time of 30 years has skills around 12D and 11D, that Yoda should have skills around 15D to 20D in 850 or so years. Lets take his sky rocketing Sense roll and add it to a mediocre to professional level lightsaber roll and get a combined score in the twenties or even thirties in D6. That is almost a sure bet to smack around even Windu. Yoda is the master, the Grand Master of the Jedi. Mace may be a senior member of the Council, but Yoda has been the man, and is the man (or green puppet). This is what I was getting at earlier, and my main reason as to why I think Windu would probably get his butt handed to him against Dooku (possibly, my only regards towards this matter is that Dooku has probably had more time to study both the skills and lightsaber handling, and Yoda was his teacher) and definitely against Yoda.

Anyhow, I would really like to see anything on leadership and council positions if you know where to look. Sounds very interesting. Of all the places I've looked all it is said is that Yoda is "a grand master" and Mace is "the lightsaber instructor" (though in the movie we see Yoda teaching a bunch of 5 - 7 year olds how to swing around lightsabers) and "a senior council member". It would be very nice to see some clarification and something different for that matter.

Edit and Note: I apologize and only realized after the fact that I used some stats in this posting to try and prove a point. If it is a problem, feel free to edit or delete my thread portion. I don't want to cause problems, but this was the only way I felt I could show that someone who is good with a lightsaber can be outclassed by someone who is not as good with a lightsaber, if they are more skilled in the force.

Otonashi
7 June 2002, 09:09 AM
Bobba Fett is not going to kill Mace, there is no money in it. Young Bobba got to see what happens when you get caught up in a war with the Jedi. I'm sure that he hates the Jedi with every fiber of his being, but he shows us later on in life that he is able to control his base emotions. Beside, Lucas hates Fett, and I doubt that he would grant that character any sort of moral justice like avenging his father death.

ALFRED_THE_EWOK
7 June 2002, 10:07 AM
Originally posted by Otonashi
Bobba Fett is not going to kill Mace, there is no money in it.

He could be hired by Palpatine/Sidious, there is enough motivation.


Originally posted by Otonashi
Beside, Lucas hates Fett, and I doubt that he would grant that character any sort of moral justice like avenging his father death.

Where does this info come from?

Nova Spice
7 June 2002, 10:09 AM
Originally posted by Otonashi

Beside, Lucas hates Fett, and I doubt that he would grant that character any sort of moral justice like avenging his father death.

I doubt Lucas would have made Jango Fett and Boba such big characters in Episode II if he hated them....don't you? :raised:

Otonashi
7 June 2002, 10:21 AM
I saw some interview with him and he kept remarking that he couldn't believe that Boba Fett was so popular and such. And considering the way he "killed off" Bobba Fett in RotJ, I don't feel that he has much regard for him. Sorry I can't be more specific than that. I'm just ranting here.

allstar6767
7 June 2002, 10:23 AM
To Krad-edis, Your scenario is exactly correct, for a knight and a master, but Mace is an accomplished Jedi Master(as is yoda), he was supposed to be around 75 in AOTC(the force keeps him young). That comparison would be much more suited to yoda compared to TPM obi. Mace is much more of diplomat than yoda, which is why I believe he is the head of the jedi council(i'm still looking for the canon), yoda tends to display feelings that he is right, and there is no other way around it, where as mace realizes that most subjects are not as black and white as the force(you notice he was a little more leniant to qui-gon and traininganakin, granted he was wrong, but everyone makes mistakes)...

Krad-edis
7 June 2002, 10:44 AM
Let us suppose that everyone lives to be one hundred years old in the Star Wars Universe, and let us suppose that Mace is 75 years old (I would like to see that one too when you find it, if that is canon). Yoda has more than ten lifetimes of experience more than Mace does to draw on. Who would you want in charge of a committee? A sixty year old who has seen the world and lived to be a competent judge in many different matters or a six year old who only wants the newest edition of Legos and GI Joes? A fair comparison in my opinion, not to discredit Mace Windu. I love his character, but to compare him to Yoda is kind of like comparing a 60 year old man to a 6 year old boy.....no contest. Mace is an accomplished Jedi Master, and Yoda is a very (1) very (2) very (3) very (4) very (5) very (6) very (7) very (8) very (9) very (10) accomplished Jedi Master. Open to discussion still, but not by me. I think I have said enough and even shown evidence to support age comparisons.

In regards to Dooku. Imagine being taken in as a Padawan by Yoda. Imagine the insight you would receive from someone so wise and skilled. I don't think we even saw Dooku try his hardest yet, and Windu looked like he was sweating. If your opinion on Mace's age is around 75, I would put it that Dooku is well over one hundred....many more years to adhere to the person's teachings who probably knows more about the force than anyone alive....

Once again, skill and age seem to outshine youth and vigor when it comes to the force. We saw Dooku mop the floor with Obi-wan and Anakin. The older you get, the more of a bada-- you become. Windu is a bada-- (in Star Wars and Pulp Fiction, and Shaft), but not as much as the two old guys who have been doing things for much longer. Disrespect them and they will beat you with their canes or lightsabers, either way, they still put the smack down, and can probably do it with impunity.:D

allstar6767
7 June 2002, 11:38 AM
Hey, what you ahve to remember is that yodas species, while living longer, matures slower, and mace is not:

a six year old who only wants the newest edition of Legos and GI Joes?
OR Full of
...youth and vigor... He is much close to the wise and experienced person, not mention Mace was probably trained under yoda at some point in time and spends nearly everday with yoda, would that not teach him wisdom just as being a padawan would? :?

Krad-edis
7 June 2002, 11:44 AM
Teach him wisdom....yes....To the point of being as wise as Yoda...no. Experiencing something first hand, and then talking to someone about it doesn't quite transend all of their worldliness to the listener. Sorry, but Mace has a long way to go before I see them as "equals in wisdom". If you want to play by the "matures slower" rules, then I guess we still have anywhere from 400 to 600 years of experience that Yoda has and Mace doesn't.

Krad-edis
7 June 2002, 11:57 AM
Originally posted by allstar6767
Hey, what you ahve to remember is that yodas species, while living longer, matures slower, and mace is not:

Since Yoda's species has never been released and we can only speculate what he is and what his species is like, how would you know whether he matures faster or slower than humans? Is this speculation as well? Sorry to send you on a "canon search", but you are full of interesting facts, that I would like to see confirmed.

Jaggard
7 June 2002, 01:19 PM
I might be wrong but check out Maces entry in the vis dic either that or the one by his spiffy light saber. I believe it says it was given to him as a symbol of his station as council leader. Now why isn't yoda council leader. He teaches all the children. That's plenty of work for the old guy. Not to mention, I don't want my managers job, I'm fine with being an imployee rather then running that place (into the ground). It also strike me that yoda may have adopted a phylosophy that is wise but hard: Understand before you act, (it's impossible to completely understand someone or thing without being that person or thing) and people must do what they must do on their own. ( this seems to be an eggzageratipon (sp :( ) of don't force your will on others. You'll notice that most of what he says is actually asking questions or getting others to question themselves. Short of teaching student he never seems to have his way, but he will express his displeasure if things go another way then what he hoped.

allstar6767
7 June 2002, 06:01 PM
Jaggard your right(Thanks tons), it does say that there, I never even noticed that, I know I saw it somewhere else too...

Darkwasp
7 June 2002, 07:38 PM
Minor Spoiler included for those who haven't seen Attack of the Clones.

Mace Windu
Though Yoda's junior by eight centuries, Mace Windu is seen as Yoda's equal in the Jedi Order, and he is the senior member of the Jedi Council. He is the council's primary liaison with the Republic Senate, and with the Supreme Chancellor in particular. He has an easy friendship with Finis Valorum and trusts Valorum's judgement in political matters as he trusts Yoda's judgment in matters of the force. He is not as familiar with Chancellor Palpatine's agenda but views him as a competent if somewhat easygoing politician.

Master Windu is respected among Jedi for his battle experience and the quiet confidence it has brought him. A popular story among the Padawans is that Mace Windu once found himself surrounded by formidable warriors known as Gank killers - all with blasters drawn. Resting one hand on his lightsaber, Windu met each Gank's eyes and uttered three words: "It's your decision." One by one, the warriors set down their weapons and surrendered.

This tale which Master Windu neither confirms nor denies, serves to point out that the Jedi Master has an uncommon understanding of the judicious use of intimidation. He has traveled the galaxy nearly as much as Master Yoda, battled a variety of foes, and perfected his own fighting style - a relentless lightsaber assault that is at once unpredictable and perfectly balanced. Other Jedi might be stronger or faster than Master Windu, but he is the recognized master of the Order's fighting techniques.

Mace Windu's fighting skills are put to the ultimate test on Geonosis, where he not only leads a Jedi assault against the Seperatists' battle driod army but also confronts the bounty hunter Jango Fett. Although he emerges triumphant, Master Windu soon realizes that the Battle of Geonosis is but a prelude for even greater battles to come.

----STAR WARS roleplaying game REVISED CORE RULEBOOK

Mace Windu is the boss. End of discussion. :D
And everyone who reads this owes me the highest vote available in member ranking, because I won't be able to type for a week after this.
:)

VixenofVenus
7 June 2002, 07:41 PM
I think that Mace may have the 'Official Title' ... but Yoda B****-Slaps him around and tells him what's up ... we all know that Yoda is the PimpDaddy Master of the Jedi Order ... OH YEAH.

Nova Spice
7 June 2002, 07:48 PM
You go GIRL! That's what I'm talking about! I agree with Vixen, Yoda is the MASTER....if he wasn't then Windu would have been the one to train Luke on Dagobah instead of Yoda. Windu is the Jedi Order's combat expert, Yoda the Order's instructor. They both share the head seat,but Yoda is the MASTER....without a doubt! I'm shocked people think otherwise! 8o

And who says you females can't think for yourselves! :p I'll run away now....

allstar6767
7 June 2002, 08:20 PM
GO DARK WASP, you did get the highest vote, and that helped me out alot, now i think people are beginning to understand that mace is just as good, if not better than yoda, even though they are both awesome, but neither are as good as Tekat, Ewok shaman turned Jedi Apprentice(my new PC that I am in all honesty taking very seriousley).

Krad-edis
8 June 2002, 12:14 AM
Well that is interesting news Jaggard, and Allstar6767 about the lightsaber presentation on Council status. Does anyone else know of Yoda's species, and can confirm Windu's age? When I make my own D6 stats for these guys I want to know as much about them as possible. I assume that Windu may be anywhere from 48 to 55 in Episode II, but now I hear the 75. Any other takers on that one?

I can understand Windu being seen as an equal on the Council with Yoda, but they are not equals by far. Sorry, but Yoda knows more about the force than anyone alive. He is the Grand Master, and I cannot see why people would wish to put stock in someone who has only a fraction of the understanding of the force and a fraction of the experience as the little green kung-fu killing machine. A little decoration on a saber does not cut it when we are dealing with 800 years of training Jedi and mastering the force. Say what you will, I am unmoved in walking away with the idea that Windu is better than Yoda.:raised: In fact, I am wondering if this is some kind of joke.

Krad-edis
8 June 2002, 12:16 AM
I would like to point out one more thing, if my computer lets me.
Yoda has forgotten more about the force than Windu could ever hope to learn! 800 freakin years worth of knowledge cannot be discredited, and by saying that Mace and Yoda are equals certainly does just that.

BrianDavion
8 June 2002, 06:55 AM
Dooku's age came up a little while ago. I'd like to point something out...in the TPM novelization it suggested Qui-Gon's master was something like 400 years old.

so dooku may very well be.. 400+ years of age

Krad-edis
8 June 2002, 07:10 AM
Christopher Lee always gets to play the old bad a--es doesn't he?

Dracula, Saruman, and Count Dooku. All older than dirt,and all can put on the hurt! Maybe he was a good 400 years old, or more. I wish George would put out an official sheet with everyone's age and just a bit of background to fill us in on all the characters who were there but got zero to three lines. I mean aren't you curious about the rest of the Jedi Council, and for all they were cracked up to be, we haven't heard a peep from any of them except Yoda, Mace, and Ki Adi Mundi. Are they all mutes?

Again, it would be nice to see something official though. I was lead to believe that they were talking about Yoda (who we know is more than 400 years old), since in Episode I, Qui-Gon said to Yoda "My Master."

FlipDog 2000
11 June 2002, 08:42 AM
I posted this in the Ep. 3 Spec. thread too....but it fits here...

Also, I would like to see Mace assigned or even volunteer to protect Padme, Leia, and the Organa family on Alderaan. He would live out the remainder of his life protecting them...not necessarily as a Jedi, cause use of the Force would call Vader and Palpy, but as a bodyguard and nothing more. He could still be one Bad-A** swordsman. Then when the time came, you would assume that he died when Tarkin tested the DS on it.

Krad-edis
13 June 2002, 02:23 PM
Originally posted by FlipDog 2000
I would like to see Mace assigned or even volunteer to protect Padme, Leia, and the Organa family on Alderaan. He would live out the remainder of his life protecting them...not necessarily as a Jedi, cause use of the Force would call Vader and Palpy, but as a bodyguard and nothing more. He could still be one Bad-A** swordsman. Then when the time came, you would assume that he died when Tarkin tested the DS on it.

That would be cool, and I have used this concept in one of my past campaigns. My players were a little upset that their Jedi Knight teacher was on Alderaan when it was destroyed. It forced them to move on and find another teacher.

Alderaan could possibly be a rallying point for some of the Old Republic Jedi to regroup and try an offensive on the Empire, I mean Kenobi was heading there after. If we don't see characters such as Kit Fisto, Plo Koon, and Ki Adi Mundi get totalled on screen, it may be safe to say that they actually surivive, and then all buy the farm on Alderaan.

Of course if this happens, in the Special Special Editions, they might change a few lines to:

Leia: "No, Aldreraan is peaceful. We have no weapons there....except Mace Windu, (turns to Vader), who would whip your a** with one hand tied behind his back. What do you think about that tough guy? "

Tarkin: "That sounds like a challenge to me,Vader."

Vader: "No, lets just go ahead with plan A. Wax the planet."

Leia: "Chicken.....buck-buck-buck-buck-buck-buck"

Well.....maybe not..:D

FlipDog 2000
14 June 2002, 09:31 AM
Either that, or in the SSE, Mace sense the DS approaching and pulls out his lightsaber and is like:

"Alright, stand back.....I can deflect it!!!!"

But I like that line because it would also enhance Obi's sensing of the destruction of Alderaan.

Stroth Marund
14 June 2002, 02:05 PM
From a recent thing I read, Mace Windu will die. But, Samuel L Jackson gets to choose how he dies. He said somethin along the lines of "I don't want to get shot in the back by some Bobo kid."

All I ca gess is Anakin kill him. From the same article, Anaking spends most of his time in the movie turning to the Dark Side and killing off all the Jedi. Maybe he joins the Serprtists? The Clone Wars is probably where most of the Jedi die, making ti just that much easier to kill every single Jedi out ther (with exceptions of Obi-Wan and Yoda).

FlipDog 2000
14 June 2002, 04:57 PM
Actually, I saw that, it was on Leno. When lucas asked him to be in SW, Sam said okay, but on two conditions...one, I get a purple lightsaber, two, I don't get shot in the back by some punk stormtrooper.

Krad-edis
14 June 2002, 10:18 PM
Originally posted by FlipDog 2000
I don't get shot in the back by some punk stormtrooper.

Obi-wan says in Episode IV that "he murdered and betrayed". I think there was some truth in what he said to Luke about what Vader did to his father (certain point of view thing), except that Vader did the murdering by betraying the Jedi. If Boba doesn't kill Windu, I would suspect that Anakin stabs Windu in the back somehow, through sneaking up on him, or with a group of now "Stormtroopers" he steps in and pretends to aid Windu but really just gives him the saber blade in the back. Anakin, by this time is probably smart enough, and twisted enough to know that the only way to kill Windu, is to cheat.

If he dies, it will be by a punk Fett or a punk Skywalker, and probably not by a punk stormtrooper.

FlipDog 2000
15 June 2002, 08:32 AM
If he dies, it will be by a punk Fett or a punk Skywalker, and probably not by a punk stormtrooper.

While I think that Fett would be a possibility, Anakin stabbing him in the back is not. While it is true that Obi tells Luke, Vader "betrayed and murdered," I think you are taking it out of context. The full dialog is:

Kenobi: "For more than a thousand generations the Jedi were the guardians of peace and justice in the galaxy. Before the dark times. Before the Empire."
Skywalker: "How did my father die?"
Kenobi: "A young Jedi named Darth Vader, who was a pupil of mine until he turned to evil, helped the Empire hunt down and destroy the Jedi knights. He betrayed and murdered your father."
(is it sad that I have that memorized?:p )

So, as you can see, Obi was talking about Anakin specifically....from a certain point of view. So, Anakin striking down Mace is a possibilty, but I think it would be face to face, Anakin/Vader has to much pride to let that one go. Plus, he already has a cheat....the Dark Side.

Corr Terek
15 June 2002, 10:12 AM
Yeah, I read that quote by Jackson, too. He said, basically, that he didn't want to die in a stupid way. So, my guess is he's gonna go out protecting someone or in some other heroic way that only Mace could pull off. (Nejaa Halcyon, anyone?).

Krad-edis
15 June 2002, 06:29 PM
Originally posted by Krad-edis


Obi-wan says in Episode IV that "he murdered and betrayed". I think there was some truth in what he said to Luke about what Vader did to his father (certain point of view thing), except that Vader did the murdering by betraying the Jedi.

I don't think I took it out of context at all. I realize that Vader did not betray and murder himself :D, but Obi-wan mentions "betrayal" as a factor, and that is the only way I see one defeating many. They trusted him, and he screwed them over. Why else bring betrayal into the conversation? Why not "he just murdered your father"? I think Anakin has some serious acts of betrayal in store for Ep III.

BTW, I also had it memorized:o

FlipDog 2000
22 June 2002, 09:05 AM
Well, I think the betrayal has to do with the Jedi Order but more importantly, Obi is talking about the betrayal of the Dark Side in conjunction with the 'murder.' Again it's Obi's wierd philosophy....from a certain point of view.

Krad-edis
23 June 2002, 04:06 AM
Originally posted by allstar6767
LMAO, Dooku beat windu, lol, thats hilarious, windu is considered the best swordsman and rivals yoda as far as force pontential

For all of you nay-sayers out there, here is an interesting little factoid from Starwars.com, which shows that Dooku may stand a chance against the legendary swordsmanship of Mace Windu. Read the words "unmatched". The guy is really good at what he does....kicking a**!

Dooku "Unmatched" (http://starwars.com/databank/character/countdooku/eu.html)

I really would like to see the two duel in "new style" versus "old style" in the next movie, but I really think that Yoda will have to do the smack down on this guy (Dooku). They could begin where the two left off before.:D I don't see it any other way. Even with Anakin's power, I think Dooku would give him a matching missing arm if they crossed paths again.

BrianDavion
23 June 2002, 09:05 AM
unmatched in the old style.. in other words dooku is the best at form II.. Windu uses form VII

Stroth Marund
23 June 2002, 02:52 PM
I dunno. I have a hunch that Anakin and Mace might go at it. That would be interesting to see. And I think Yoda and Dooku fight again, this time on Dagobah (remember the dark place Luke went into). Its said that Yoda killed a Sith there, and well, I guess Dooku's a Sith lord.

Krad-edis
23 June 2002, 07:52 PM
Originally posted by BrianDavion
unmatched in the old style.. in other words dooku is the best at form II.. Windu uses form VII

Exactly, which would be kind of like seeing a master of Tae Kwon Do square off against someone who was a master of Karate. The best of each fighting each other....I think I mentioned something like this before.....


Originally posted by Krad-edis
I really would like to see the two duel in "new style" versus "old style" in the next movie,

Oh, yeah...I did, not in the same words, but I kind of hinted at it.

One thing that I would bet on is Dooku and Mace, if Mace and Dooku fought, it would be a good one, and I don't think Mace would walk in there with the attitude that he outclassed Dooku. Remember, Episode II made reference to Yoda as being the "bad a**" swordsman, and Dooku held his own against him...and after kicking the crap out of two young guys too.

Moff Neomen
24 June 2002, 08:08 AM
Personally, I'm betting on a Boba-style death from Windu. Ya don't show a kid holding his father's head that just got cut off by a guy and not expect him to do something about it.

I'm guessing that Boba has SOME kind of part in his death...though I doubt that it's a straight fight. Perhaps Boba sets up an ambush that leads Mace into an overmatched situation...say, surrounded by stormtroopers while trying to protect someone. Perhaps he's learned of Palpatine's plot to kill Padme (another supposition), and sacrifices himself after Boba leads a bunch of stormtroopers to him. Of course, how many stormtroopers do you think would survive it? Boba might get the final shot, though.

There are holes in this theory, though...the Fett family's notoriously bad karma versus Jedi, for example. But it holds up versus Jackson's comments...he's not dying by getting shot in the back, he's hacking apart a batallion of stormtroopers in order to protect Padme (and dealing with a vengeful bounty hunter).

MERC
1 September 2005, 02:06 PM
From where did the knowledge of the death of Mace Windu come? We see him fly out the window, but did we realy see him die? After all The Emperor and Loke both survived somthing similar as far as I know! Loke grabbed the antenna in Claud City. The Emperor somehow suvived ep: VI, right?

boccelounge
1 September 2005, 10:40 PM
Originally posted by MERC
From where did the knowledge of the death of Mace Windu come? We see him fly out the window, but did we realy see him die? After all The Emperor and Loke both survived somthing similar as far as I know! Loke grabbed the antenna in Claud City. The Emperor somehow suvived ep: VI, right?

Well... I think the filmmakers rely a bit (too much) on their audience comprehending the broader story meanings in order to understand that even though it wasn't explicitly detailed: yes, in Ep3, Mace died, and yes, in Ep6 the Emperor died.

And, for you more literally-minded fans, I quote here the Ep3 script (my emphasis added):

Just as MACE is about to slash PALPATINE, ANAKIN steps in and cuts off the Jedi's hand holding the lightsaber.

As MACE stares at ANAKIN in shock, PALPATINE springs to life.

The full force of Palpatine's powerful Bolts blasts MACE. He attempts to deflect them with his one good hand, but the force is too great. As blue rays engulf his body, he is flung out the window and falls twenty stories to his death. No more screams. No more moans. PALPATINE lowers his arm.

PALPATINE: Power! Unlimited power!

You see, Anakin Skywalker was once a Jedi (one of the good guys) and he did terrible things (like helping kill Mace Windu), and became a Sith (one of the bad guys).

Then, some time later, his son redeemed both Anakin and the Galaxy by defeating The Emperor (the baddest of the bad guys).



Are we really talking about this? Are there REALLY people that don't get it???

Krad-edis
2 September 2005, 03:55 AM
Originally posted by boccelounge
You see, Anakin Skywalker was once a Jedi (one of the good guys) and he did terrible things (like helping kill Mace Windu), and became a Sith (one of the bad guys).

Then, some time later, his son redeemed both Anakin and the Galaxy by defeating The Emperor (the baddest of the bad guys).


I totally missed those. I'm going to have to watch the entire series over again and take notes this time. Thanks for the insight. I'll let you know if I disagree with you after reviewing my notes. :D

boccelounge
2 September 2005, 08:21 AM
Originally posted by Krad-edis
I totally missed those. I'm going to have to watch the entire series over again and take notes this time. Thanks for the insight. I'll let you know if I disagree with you after reviewing my notes. :D

Thanks-- for taking it as (jokingly) intended. :)

MERC
2 September 2005, 12:57 PM
Are we really talking about this? Are there REALLY people that don't get it??? I get it! I have seen all the films plenty of times, and I know that the Emperor "dies" in RotJ. However, his force spirit lives on to return in one of his clones, right? This is according to the EU books, right?


The full force of Palpatine's powerful Bolts blasts MACE. He attempts to deflect them with his one good hand, but the force is too great. As blue rays engulf his body, he is flung out the window and falls twenty stories <B>to his death</B>. No more screams. No more moans. PALPATINE lowers his arm. Ok, this setles that... I have not read the script or any part thereof before so I just wanted confirmation! It is not as if he was cut in half or somthing... From what I see in the film, he could have survived the fall somehow! The script makes it prety clear cut thou.

PsychoInfiltrator
2 September 2005, 03:14 PM
I get it! I have seen all the films plenty of times, and I know that the Emperor "dies" in RotJ. However, his force spirit lives on to return in one of his clones, right? This is according to the EU books, right?

Actually, the EU comic books, and it is a generally accepted fact that it was another Sith who masqueraded as the Emperor or the separate entity of a clone. (Like Joruus C'Baoth) This is put forth in the Thrawn Duology, and appears to be what the continuity people say. (Back when the comics containing the 'resurrected' Emperor were released, continuity editors were not very strict.)

MERC
5 September 2005, 06:46 AM
The good thing is that in a RPG, as GM I can have it any way I like... I think that my players will encounter a rumor that Mase might have survived! They surely have not read the script so they cant know for sure... I can decide later if he did!

Darth_Xanthor
13 September 2005, 02:03 PM
The wonders and GLORy of being a Game Master, or as I like to call it GALAXY MASTER.....lolB)

darth_phobeius
17 September 2005, 10:51 PM
I thought Mace was a "Bad Mo Fo" and tend to believe he stuck the landing, said screw this crap with young whiny upstarts, went and got some new hands, and went back to his home planet which is full of Force users and settled their little civil war and reigned supreme. Am I dillusional? Yes. Do I care? No. I am the GM and that is how I play it.

MERC
10 November 2005, 03:42 PM
On the other hand, it IS your game, you may do as you wish!
By the way, I Ep II was on TV here a few days ago... I have seen it a few times now, but what about all the falling / jumping done by Anakin and Kenobi...? If they can do it, so can Mace!
And yes, I know he didn't but my players would not...

Lucas Carr
10 November 2005, 07:23 PM
Originally posted by MERC
On the other hand, it IS your game, you may do as you wish!
By the way, I Ep II was on TV here a few days ago... I have seen it a few times now, but what about all the falling / jumping done by Anakin and Kenobi...? If they can do it, so can Mace!
And yes, I know he didn't but my players would not...

And talking about AotC, we already know that Mace knows how to fall without getting hurt, as he did so in the arena. Not that it would help much with the distance he fell in RotS.